PM Lee on nepotism and his father’s legacy
May 17th, 2010 | 
Author: Dear PM Lee,
I refer to your interview by Charlie Rose as reported by Straits Times on 16 Apr 2010.
You said our entire system is founded on meritocracy where you get the job because you are the best man and not because of connections. But according to a Straits Times report on 20 Oct 2009, your father said that China’s princelings like Li Peng’s son and daughter may never be recognised if they weren’t well connected because China is such a big place. Considering that the chance of you becoming the prime minister out of about 2.5 million Singaporean adults is a mere 0.00004%, we don’t need to be as big as China to appreciate your father’s belief that meritocracy aside, you need the right connections to stand out amongst so many Singaporeans. So if you share your father’s beliefs, you shouldn’t rule out the importance of connections and you or at least your father has no moral basis to sue IHT for allegedly saying something that your father essentially believes in.
You said you lose credibility and moral authority if people do not think you are the best man for the job. On what basis do you assert that? Just as you require IHT to prove their assertions, so too must you prove your assertions failing which you have no right to assert them. You have no right to say that you lose credibility when people do not think you’re the best person unless you can prove it. You have no right to say that it is a fundamental issue of fitness to govern unless you can prove it. You said it is a basic Confucian precept that you are allowed to make the right decisions only if you have the moral right. But Confucian moral right comes from being virtuous, not being the best.
You said being put in the same list as Kim Jong II is as good as an attack on the moral fibre of your trust with the people. But the list included so many Asian nations, are you saying it is an attack on all those nations as well? Yet none of the leaders in those nations are even half as bothered as yourself. Why are you so especially sensitive?
You give the impression that you are very insecure as though your very authority can be easily undermined by people saying you are not the best. What if we conducted a survey and found that 33% of Singaporeans find that you are not the best, would that undermine your moral right to govern? If we concede that there may be 33% who think that you are not the best, then why is it such a big deal that one journalist thinks so too? If your worry is that the other 66% may lose confidence in you when they come across the article saying you are not the best, then wouldn’t that make their confidence in you shaky and weak to begin with?
You said the same journalist and newspaper has done it again. But what the journalist has done this time is to merely state facts and the facts speak for themselves. Unless the facts are erroneous, which they are not, you have no basis to make an issue out of it.
You said the IHT can bring their lawyers to prove what they say is true. That shows your basic ignorance of the basic law concept of presumption of innocence. As Mr Shanmugam would always emphasize, it is never up to the accused to prove that he is innocent. The onus is always on the plaintiff to prove the accused’s guilt instead. As such, the onus is on you the plaintiff to prove what the IHT said is false. The onus is not on IHT to prove what they said is true. If you don’t even understand this basic law concept, how can you even say you are the best?
You said your father made a state where there was none. But the state of Singapore was already in the making for 140 years before your father took over. The system that could run without him was not made by him but was bequeathed to him by the British.
Thank you
Ng Kok Lim
Posted in 
Give the Leesa break.
What can be more humiliating? Temasek (remember his daughter-in-law is CEO)ignores MM again. http://atans1.wordpress.com/2010/05/17/temasek-mm-lee-being-ignored-ii/
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Woow! A very well written article that really refresh and rejuvenate my “monday-blue”!
Thank you very much, indeed, my dear Kok Lim!
Cheers and keep up with the good and fabulous work!
Down LKY/LHL, Down LKY/LHL,………… Forever, down, LKY/LHL…….. Singapore is a country owned by all Singaporeans and not a “private-company” owned by the Leefamily!
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very logical article… couldn’t agree more
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This limp-wristed idiot is as qualified as in any other dictator state in the world, because those countries practice nepotism.
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Yeah, right. Our PM would have us believe he got the job because of his meritocratic credentials? 3 recession over the last 10 years in Singapore and no Plan Bs is an extremely poor track record to have in his party.
I did not vote for PM Lee, did you? Is winning the prime minister seat from years of walkovers MERITOCRACY to you? Or is it because your father place you there? Ever wonder when your father is still mentoring you after all this years? If it is purely meritocracy as you claim, why is your daddy still looking after you all these years even when you go to work?
How the hell did this guy be allowed to make such slap-in-your-face-you-DAFT-Singaporean remarks?
What does he think we are? Gullible fools?
If PM lee wants to prove his salt, he should contest one on one with a non-PAP candidate at the election. Then he can claim he got his seat through his own effort. And he can’t gerry-mander when he does it. Is he so insecure he needs to keep harping about meritocracy all the time? If you didn’t earn your seat, of course you would do that. Other than that, he wants to send a clear signal to his PAP members that he is still the man in charge in this country and not his dad. This man is living in his dad’s shadow. What kind of leaders do we have?
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Thank you very much, Kok Lim for a very well written article!
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I like it…A person struggling to hold on to power when disdain and displeasure are increasing will become hypersensitive
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And Please, If LHL is indeed the best person for the job and our country is at its current point, i really don’t want to imagine what will happen if a second fiddle did his job…yah right
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Mr. Ng Kok Lin BE PREPARED
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Very well written article. PM Lee just cannot handle the truth. the truth hurt!
I am disappointed that IHT did not contest it. Because of this, IHT has lost credibility too.
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Who is this Ng Kok Lim…is he BESTest to talk about the BEST Singaporean for the PM job?
With Loong’s ability, he does not need his father and still shine in the army to be a general (paper…i.e. on paper…is also counted). No no how can the 66.6% allow this guy to critize the great leader whom he said was even compared with the GREAT Kim the Socond.
What, is Nr trying to say LHL is just junior LKY or “Lee the Second”
Look let me tell you how good LHL Loong is and how much he has given to Singapore. Compare to Bill Gates job his job is billions of times more complicated and yet he is being paid US$3 million and Bill Gates by the billions.
Look at it the other way, he is age 58 and Bill Gates is 55. If not because of he being tied up by his love for Singapore and stay to serve as PM, he will definately be richer than Bill Gates…as he has First Class Honours from Cambridge and a MBA from Harvard whereas Bill is a Harvard drop-out…yea a drop out.
PM LEE is the best …nothing-but-the-best…according to his Father to start off!
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It really makes more sense for the accuser to prove the accused’s guilt, rather than the other way round.
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Being academically smart does not make him a leader. It also does not make him the best, whatever “best” means to him.
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A book by Malcom Gladwell called Outliers, nicely encapsulates what has gone on here. It talks about people like Bill Gates, who excelled at what they do, not just because they were talented but because they were exposed to opportunities that allowed them to capitalise on opportunities. In Gate’s case, he was allowed access to high powered computers in secondary school. These computers were not available to a lot of people, let alone teenagers. So when the computer age kicked off, here was this kid with several years experience coding when everyone else had next to none.
To bring the story back, while PM Lee did become PM because he was talented and right for the job, both in terms of experience and education, it was this plus his connections and up bringing which have made him the most qualified to do the job. Just like US president George Bush and George W Bush. No nepotism there, they were elected, but the connections they had, certainly made them strong candidates.
I don’t hold it against the parliament, I’d want the most qualified person in the role too.
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Nobody in the world will praise ownself that he is the best.Let people decide whether you are good or otherwise.If without connections,Ho Ching may be only a general admin officer in the army.Small kids also know.
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well… the fact that Singapore only have 3 PMs, and 2 of them are Lees clearly hinted at a tint of nepotism.
For LKY and LHL to come out and sue IHT clearly proved their guilt, and muddle the water even further.
Taking into account the amount of “brilliant” leaders we had leading us in the 1980 to 1990s, to appoint LHL at 43 to be DPM, and PM at the age of 53 yr old shows a clear lack of transparency in the government highest offices, and a totally lack of individism in the parliament.
This is how sad our “meritocarcy” government had became. The winds of change is blowing… its time to sweep away the old and corrupted.
Vote for a fresh start, vote for your future
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To the author:
Beware of what you are saying. The ISD will come after you soon. We now have a new agency that tracks people via IP Address on the internet. We will hunt you down and sue you in court.
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Sissy Lee after you your son will take over the PM job ah? Why? He also will become the best man for the PM job ah? How come your family all soooooooooooooo clever? Is it because money steal not enough ah?
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Lee Sain Loose you papa is a despot; you a crackpot; wonder what your son is? May be a peepot!
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Wah! Ng Kok Lin again. He can replace LHL as pm this time. Yes. How can pm insult china li peng? Can pm be sued for this? Why only he can defame people? So if pm doesn’t sue Ng, does it mean that what Ng said is correct. I think if pm said he is the best, can we conduct a survey to see whether Singaporean believe so? We all know the answer.
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A Chinese saying: “paper cannot contain the fire”. LHL is doing just that. Everybody knows nepotism is involved in this case, there’s no running away or denying in the long run. Let’s see how long the “paper can contain the fire”.
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You should compare PM LEE with other politicians in the world. Not Bill Gates. If PM LEE is in it for the money, he should leave and join his brother. This is public service. If you want more cash, he should work fo Bill Gates. But I doubt Bill would want a politician. Our politicians are in it for the easy money. You mean PM LEE spends time working hard? He has men under him to do his bidding. What PM LEE does is true to his words: “I have to spent my time, thinking how to fix them…” Or have you already forgotten?
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Well said, very poignant article. And what Loong’s ability is ex-sillysingaporean rubbishing about?? Just name one special ability other than the one in slapping another silly…ouch! Please don’t insult Bill Gates by comparing Loong with him. At the very least, Bill Gates sold the world lots of buggy OS for a fortune. What did Loong have to offer? Gambling dens and vice shoved down our throats??
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Come on!Give pinky a break!Wait he grow more white hair and cancer relapse!We don’t want another state funeral so soon. Its expensive u know!
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WOW… I love this article!!
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@ex-sillygaporean
MBA from Harvard so what?!
Nowadays MBAs from Harvard also jobless.
First Class Hons from Cambridge so what?!
Nowadays everywhere… plus there’s grade inflation in UK, you neber heard before meh?
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IHT did not contest because the case would be fought in SG court, which means the chances of winning is almost too remote. If Singapore is real, they should allow this case to be fought in international waters!
father head of our security forces etc
wife holding our purse.
friends and classmates all in senior positions.
of course there is no nepotism, i am sure there isnt, its all fabricated. he he he
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When you don’t know much about common local food in your own country, you are definitely not the best man for the job.
Out of 3 million Singaporeans, he is the only one who thinks that there are cockles in Mee Siam.
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ex-sillygaporean: May 17, 2010 at 11:53 am
Dear ex-Singaporean
You no doubt have heard of George Bush Jr., the ex-President of the United States of America. Bush Jr. was a joke and yet he was President for two terms. But this was not without the help of his father George Bush Sr. Ditto for ex-President John F Kennedy. If not for his father Joes Kennedy.
By the way, Lee Hsien Loong may not be a joke like Bush how did you arrived that LHL should be earning billions more than Gates because Gates did not even completing his university degree? What about Henry Ford or Richard Branson or Steve Jobs? I am seriously apprehensive about your sense of reasoning.
LHL is possibly our worst Prime Minister so far. He does not have vision nor does he have any direction for the country.
Pray tell us what has LHL done that is noteworthy so far? Yes, he increased the salaries of the ministers to such shameful levels and this is possibly the talk of the town even to this day. Yes, the economy seems to grown but ask the average man in the street if he has derive any real benefit from it?
LHL brought in far too many foreigners that if an incident like that in Batam were to happen (and it can easily happen), then we are in deep waters. The cost of living has increased. HDB flats are un- affordable. Foreigners compete with Singaporeans for jobs. The quality of life is getting poorer for the average Singaporeans.
Socially, Singaporeans are now an unhappy lot. They have to put up with the influx of foreigners (36% of our population) and we seem to have taken have some steps back. We have strange neighbours from strange places. Wasn’t it difficult enough integrating the Chinese, Malays, Indians and Eurasians? Before we can complete that task, we now have people from the Philippines, Myanmar, Chinese (not Teochew, Cantonese, Hokkiens and Kheks but Mongolians, Manchurians and from Sin Chiang), Nepalese, Indonesians, Indians from all over India (instead of Sikhs, Tamils and Sindhi’s).
We should rename our country the United Nations of Singapore and say it is LHL’s legacy.
ex-sillygaporean, if I were you I would not crow too loudly about LHL. Sorry Sir.
Regards
ST
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Thanks for this well-argued article. It really points straight to the root of the problem.
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Nepotism is one thing,good government,another.
I am honestly more concerned about a good government and a PM who really cares for the citizens’ welfare.
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A silly hot-tempered ah qua becomes a BG and PM because of his old man … this is proof that there is no meritocracy in Singapore.
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Serious thots, don’t take what ex-sillygaporean said too seriously. Didn’t you see the humour and irony in what he wrote? Anyways, PM Lee Hsien Loong looks old and jaded if he were to be standing next to British PM David Cameron or British DPM Nick Clegg!
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LHL did even better than the British colonial masters. Singaporeans serve the British colonial masters then. Now Singaporeans serve Indians, Chinese, Myanmar, Filipinos, Cambodians now as our retrenched managers drive them to the IRs and our ladies clean their houses for them.
I was a private when in N.S. Any promotion has to be justified and so I was not promoted. He is a general because any non-promotion will have to be justified. Is this meritocracy?
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Mohammed Ali called himself the greatest.
Lxl called himself the best.
Is he about to retire from politics to enter the boxing ring?
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“When you don’t know much about common local food in your own country, you are definitely not the best man for the job.
Out of 3 million Singaporeans, he is the only one who thinks that there are cockles in Mee Siam.”
In the kingdom of the sighted the only blind man is king.
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What a hypocrite when you say one thing and then do another. When you argue for democracy you only allow one sided story. The censorship of posting is rampant. The removal of posting is disgraceful. The temasek review is a first class hypocrite.
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Aiyo,
Ng Kok Lim, don’t try to speak like you know the law when u are not a lawyer leh. very xia suay one leh.
The concepts of ‘presumption of innocence’ and ‘accused’ and ‘guilt’ are not relevant here la. The IHT case was a civil trial leh.
and your attempt to educate LHL on the burden of proof is also way off. i would feel very malu-ated if i were you man. first, it was an action in defamation, which means the LHL side only needed to prove whatever IHT published lowered LHL’s standing in the eyes of a third person. IHT will only then need to show truth in its ‘allegations’ if it’s relying on the defence of justification la. they can choose not to bother with establishing truth if they wish to rely on other defences.
so hor, next time b4 u want to write on a subject which you are not well-versed in, please seek some advice b4 exposing to all your inaptitude ok? but ok la, we also need more ppl like u in society. if not lawyers go eat what right?
nevertheless, with some respect to you, the rest of your article is well-articulated.
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isd
we have agency to get you.hahaha
maybe you should get yourself first and send yourself to woodbridge, you sure need that check-get-up…hahaha
you sure fit to join commi china, myanmar and good old kim up there…hahaha
GO GET YOURSELF A “GET FUCK CHECKUP” !!!! asshole
who are you trying to frighten, old cocks and hens.???
or are you trying to frighten the children ??? good for nothing..
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I saw MM on China TV, he was hardly able to walk. And I saw his son at the Zoo with Indo president, the Indo guy looks so vibrant while he look like a pale shadow haggard with all GREY hair.
If GKS was MM’s comrade, why he did not attend the state funeral and instead chose to go to China?
Did you see them on TV?
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Wow!
Look at this brave bunch of Singaporeans. True Singaporeans who are not afraid of ISD. Keep it up!
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名不正则言不顺
By putting Ho Ching as the CEO of Temasek, there is no word that he can use to justify his leadership as the PM of Singapore.
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It is a pity we are subject to self-aggrandisement of those in power. We are supposed to be in a germ free political environment and pay big bucks for it. They must even avoid the appearance of nepotism and not wait to be proven otherwise.
The threat of lawsuits have prevented any inquiry into certain appointments which look fortuitous. But the fact that there is no indepth inquiry does not mean there is no nepotism. Only fear is the deterrence.
Those in power must ensure there is no whiff of abuse of power and not wait for people to prove that there is. It is a waste of time and people will assume that there is if the powers that be deter any close examination.
We must change our political culture to be such that if you are in power it precludes your relatives from high positions that depend ultimately on your decision. They should not put such people in high positions and say to all and sundry, ‘Please prove it! Otherwise, you get sued for it!’ After all we pay millions to these people and we do deserve that they avoid any controversial appointment and not wait to be told not to make such appointments.
Even if one’s relative is a suitable candidate, the very appointment brings up the question of check and balances propounded by MM himself. Can there be check and balances when practically all our reserves are in the hands of the Father, the son and the daughter in law?
Only God can be beyond question in such a situation and are we to believe they are gods?
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This is a good critical article and in lay man terms. Keep it up.
To ISD, do you really believe what you have been doing is right? Well Mas Selamat can elude you right under your nose, instead of going after real terrorists, you want to continue to bully it’s harmless citizens on behalf or Imperial famiLee?
Try bullying the people further and see if you Singapore gets full international media coverage with multiple international organisations coming after you; see if it ends up penny wise pound foolish to continue the bullying.
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Can anyone enlighten me if I heard of a name being mentioned Ho Peng recently – not sure which govt ministry. Is this gentleman related to Ms Ching, a nephew or cousin of some sort?
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Looking at the statements by Kok Lim, couldn’t agree more. But looking at the whole picture of Singapore-of who and what we have achieved today, i strongly believe that PAP/Govt has done a pretty good job. No doubt it was ruled by the “Lee” family but i guess having a son to succeed his father is “ok”. – Could have been someone else, but if PM Lee ain’t suitable to the job and knowing such huge resposibility, why would he have taken that space. For that millions? i guess MM Lee, his dad could have help him to have his own career and fared much better-monetarilly. I guess PM Lee have followed his father in his younger days, felt and learnt from his Dad how the govt was run and from there, as a younger generation he is able to continue and lead Singapore as the current PM. Of course, there can be another leader who is able to take up this job but why make statements of its the “Lees” who are ruling this country, i guess end of the day, we are all humans, and i strongly believe, people of Singapore would like to have a govt. that loves the Nation and their jobs. Lets just hope more young ones speak up and voice their opinions.
An opposition party( a strong and logical one) is necessary as an audit or checksum to look at the decisions made by the govt and how it really has an impact on the citizens of Singapore.
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@boots, please lar, you know civil law bo?
If the PM accused IHT of misleading article, then the onus is on the PM to prove otherwise lar.
If PM say IHT lying, then he has to prove that IHT is lying, not the otherway around.
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AIYAH, HARRY LEEGALISED CORUPTION AND NEPOTISM TO HIS FAMILY’S ADVANTAGE LAH, WITH ALL THE STATE’S INSTITUTIONS AT HIS BECK AND CALL, ANYTHING ELSE THEY SAY TO THE WORLD AND US IS NOTHING BUT BULLSHIT!!!!!!
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@anonymous:
May 18, 2010 at 1:32 am
“What a hypocrite when you say one thing and then do another. When you argue for democracy you only allow one sided story. The censorship of posting is rampant. The removal of posting is disgraceful. The temasek review is a first class hypocrite.”
I am puzzled too and experienced same discrepancy some of the time.
Could TR editor/moderator-in-chief confirm and kindly explain the situation as to whether it is a technical problem or some other sensitivities?
Thanks n looking forward to a fair and honest reply.
Regaeds
Mod’s Note: TR normally DO NOT delete any posting unless it is Spam and totally Irrelevant to the article. What might have happened to missing posts might be tagging of the said post as SPAM by Akismat, which is automatically deleted by the system.
An example of post which will be marked as Spam is one containing plenty of external links.
As of 18th May 2010, Akismat stats on our site are: 21,686 spams caught, 96,816 legitimate comments, and an overall accuracy rate of 98.269%.
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Hi Johnson. HO PENG is the sister of Ho Ching, PM’s wife. Ho Peng was recently promoted to director general of education.
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Anon,
Ha! I don’t believe this, PM Li was talking in USA last month about meritocracy. Waa, so many brains are in Yew, Ching and Peng families.
Are they really very clever, in your opinion? Is Singapore part of China? How is the political system works there. Is this a Monarchy S’ngapore. Sorry for ignorant. My country in Belgium so good. I heard about Singapore Li Kwan Yen very great.
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boots,
you don’t need to be a lawyer to understand the basic concept of law. as far as the application of the concept of “presumption of innocence” is concerned, nothing is wrong, nothing xia suay.
the concept of ‘presumption of innocence’ is valid in as far as what PM Lee said himself. PM Lee said IHT can prove what they say is true and if PM Lee is accusing IHT of saying something that is not true, then the concept of ‘accused’, ‘guilt’ will apply. PM Lee is accusing IHT, so IHT is the ‘accused’. since someone is being accused, the burden of proof of guilt must rest with the PM Lee who is making the accusation. nothing to be malu.
your descripton of defamation starts with LHL needing to prove that IHT lowered LHL’s standing in the eyes of public. but that’s not what LHL said. LHL said they are suing to make sure what IHT said is true. which means LHL is accusing IHT of telling lies. since it was LHL who is accusing IHT of telling lies, the onus therefore lies with LHL to prove that IHT is telling lies.
so nothing wrong with the application of the concept of “presumption of innocence” here.
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boots: May 18, 2010 at 1:37 am
Xanadu: May 18, 2010 at 7:54 pm
Boots & Xanadu
Aiyoh. Whatever law, be it common law or statutes, if the cases concern the Lees end in the Singapore courts, they would be sent to High Court Judge Choo Han Teck.
There will be no ‘presumption of innocence’. There will be no ‘accused’. There will be no defence. Even IHT case will become a criminal trial.
IHT did the clever thing – they surrendered and paid some small money lah. If IHT go before this “siow” Justice Choo, he could order billions to be paid in damages and bankrupt the newspaper.
ST
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to Singaporean: May 18, 2010 at 12:48 am
“…I was a private when in N.S. Any promotion has to be justified and so I was not promoted. He is a general because any non-promotion will have to be justified….”
That is the knock out punch. Nice one.
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ever since, sissy pinky become PM, national pride and people morale and welfare had been all time low.
Look, he
- open FT flood gate
- going to fail IR
- stupid MBT for rocket hdb price
- Mas Selamat
- keep jokers like LSS who can’t sing, worst than Wong Kan’t Sing.
- his cabinet quality is like animal grade, got Hen, Cow, Horse (Mah). Trying to have all the animal signs in chinese zodiac?
- rising living cost
- lose our $ through his wifey.
- no vision, cannot lead, how to be PM?
No1 in singapore would believe he is fit to be PM.
After he is kick out in next election, we are sure with his talent, he can always walk the streets of bugis like how he do his sissy parade walk in germany.
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Anon,
How about Ho Ching Road at Taman Jurong? Was the road name after her mother or father name or name after her remarkable perfomance at GLC/TH?
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Alas,there’s I see there’s hope for Singapore.Long live the people’s champion.Well written article.Packs alot of sense and ‘ouch’ punch.
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Although i could agree with the general thrust of Ng’s article, i do not find it very well written.
Firstly the reference to LKY is irrelevant. Ng concedes and challenges LHL “if you share your father’s belief…”. Take note that LHL is LHL and LKY is LKY. It cannot be assumed that LHK shares his father’s belief. LHL didn’t at all say those words his father said about Li Peng of China. Therefore the opening salvo was completely off track unfortunately.
Secondly NG challenges our PM “You have no right to say that you lose credibility when people do not think you’re the best person unless you can prove it. ” is again very weak. What’s wrong with the LHL statement “no one will trust me if i am not the best man”. What is there to prove? Is it not obvious, if anyone is not the best, he can’t be trusted always? What really needs to be proven is this: do people trust him because he is the best man, or do they “trust” him because of nepotism as alleged. Hence again i do not feel at all comfortable with NG’s challenge, i think the intention is correct but the logic is all warped.
Thirdly, it was a bit too presumptious when NG said “The journalist had stated the facts..” meaning to say nepotism exists. I think that is the whole point. LHL think it is not nepotism. Many people disagree. Therefore there is dispute. At any point in time prior to judgement dispensation, no one can say “this is FACT, it is nepotism” except perhaps in kopitiam-mode. What’s more important is to evaluate whether or not he is the best man, earned through solid universally acknowledged documented achievements. We can’t pre-judge and declare that it is FACT that nepotism exists. In the interest of justice, you can’t declare a-priori that it is FACT. The focus should be first to prove that he is not the best man, then only you can say that nepotism exists.
Concerning the strong wordings which implicate that PM knows next to nothing about the Law, it is hard to make a judgement, because i am not a lawyer. I see some apparently learned opinions in both directions being posted above, which makes me even more confused as a layman. I hope that NG KOK LIM is a lawyer, and does have something more to offer, else it would be somewhat rude to make an accusation of such severity, not to mention, it puts him in a precarious postition.
In conclusion, i would repeat that if any one wants to prove a case of nepotism, the best course of action is to highlight the list of terrible failures that transpired since power was transfered. In the interest of justice, it cannot be considered as nepotism, if in fact, our Prime Minister is really wonderful and universally considered as brilliant, offering creative and long-ranged solutions that bring happiness prosperity and hope to all we loyal Singaporean Citizens. Has he done that? If the answer is “yes” it can’t be nepotism.
Personally i would say “no”, but this is strictly my personal opinion of course.
zero
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Very well said by ZERO
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Hahahaha….
I really really really like the repetitive “Your father” this and “Your Father” that…. hahahaha….
Damn kick-ass funny….
Darthvader says: “I am (kerrrr) your (kerrr) father (kerrr)…”
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I am your (and yes, I mean you) Father…
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if find your rebuttal very badly written. but perhaps because you think you write well even though you write badly, you may misconstrue a piece of good writing as bad writing because it differs so greatly from yours.
it’s definitely relevant. it wasn’t just LHL who sued IHT. LKY also sued IHT. so at the very least, by LKY’s admission, LKY has no right to even sue IHT.
next. if LHL is not in agreement with LKY, then he shouldn’t have sued IHT together with LKY. he would have said “father, you believe in knowing people but i don’t. that’s why it is not right for you to sue IHT, i will sue IHT on my own accord.” but that’s clearly not what happened. LHL sued IHT together with LKY and in that sense they were in the same boat, they had the same convictions, they shared the same beliefs.
of course you have to prove it. are you saying that if your father does not think he is the best father he will lose the confidence to continue to be your father? are you saying if LKY thinks that GKS is better than him he will lose confidence and therefore give his seat up to the latter. that’s bullshit isn’t it. so unless this bullshit is proven, you have no right to exert it.
so i don’t think NG’s logic is wrapped. yours is.
you are saying rubbish. the journalist stated facts about the kinship between different generations of leaders in the same country. that is not an allegation of nepotism but a statement of facts that politics running in the family is common in asia. so that is not the whole point. the point is not that LHL thinks it’s not nepotism. the point is LHL thinks the article implies nepotism when it obviously doesn’t.
so to say the “his is FACT, it is nepotism” is therefore a false accusation on IHT because at no point in time would you find those words in the article. find them for us please if you can.
whether he is the best man is not the least important. the “FACT that nepotism exists” is what LHL insists that IHT implies which IHT does not.
you don’t have to declare a fact to be a fact a priori. a fact is simply a fact. the focus is never to prove that he is the best man. was ronald reagan the best man during his time? did it matter? no. what matters is he is the one that people want.
you don’t need to be a lawyer to use your brain. if you can’t understand the most fundamental law concept or the most fundamental economic concept like demand and supply and have to depend on everyone else for anything else then you’re essentially good for practically nothing else aren’t you? what precarious position? he has the protection of the entire ISD, teams of lawyers, what precarious position?
the problem is IHT wasn’t proving nepotism. IHT was just stating the facts that leadership tends to run in the family. it was just an observation based on facts. whatever nepotism was insinuated by LHL and his father, not IHT.
our PM is wonderfully lacking i would say and brilliant only in math and nothing else. creative solutions like dumping foreigners in singapore is one example of his wonderful lack of ideas. so it is not rude at all to not accuse but to state his shortcomings never mind how severe they are.
your opinion is of course unsubstantiated and therefore next to worse than thrash.
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Our ST journalists can’t even write half as well as Kok Lim. We need more people like Kok Lim to write critical reports especially on our political system !!!
Any comment from ST ?
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Without PAP, there will be no modern Singapore today! Can you imagine the fact there is nothing to eat in the 60 and 70? Ppl have to survive on eating tree root..etc. For those who never suffer hunger and poverty before, you got no right to comment on PAP policy!
Long live PAP!
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i find Mr Ng’s article very well written. i find yours very badly written.
LHL sued IHT together with LKY. if we concede that LKY is of the belief that connections are important, then LKY shouldn’t even have the right to sue IHT. so unless LHL endorses LKY’s views, he wouldn’t have sued IHT together with him. he would have said “father, you have no right to sue IHT because you are basically in agreement with what you purport IHT to imply. i will sue IHT on my own.” the fact that LHL sued IHT together with LKY means that he finds his father’s views acceptable and does not contradict his intention to sue. it suggests a concurrence of views and beliefs.
the statement “no one will trust me if i am not the best man” is wrong because you may trust a person even if he is not the best. for example, your washing machine is spoilt. you call someone to fix it. do you need the person to prove that he is the best repairer in this world before you trust him fix your washing machine? of course not. as long as he is qualified, not necessarily that he is the best, you let him do the job. hence, the right thing to say is that “no one will trust me if they think i am not qualified”. “no one will trust me if i am not the best” is wrong. because you don’t need to be the best to do a good job. so if there’s any wrap in logic, it is yours.
the journalist stated the facts of politics running in the family, not nepotism exists. to say that the former is the latter is to twist facts and then turn it into an allegation that was never there. that’s dirty, that’s despicable, that’s what you, LKY and LHL are doing.
you got the whole point wrong. there was never any inference of nepotism to begin with. LHL thinks there is allegation of nepotism. he made it up when it was never there. so no one is saying prior to judgement that the fact is nepotism. the fact has always been that politics runs in the family and that doesn’t equate to nepotism.
it is not important to evaluate that he is the best man, only that he is qualified and that he cares for the people. earning a math degree doesn’t make you the best politician, only a good not even best mathematician. even earning a nobel price in physics doesn’t make you the best physicist. only one in many centuries do you get someone like einstein who is the undisputed best.
once again you can’t insinuate that there has been a declaration that nepotism exists. there has never been. it has always been the plain simple fact that politics runs in the family. don’t turn that into an allegation that nepotism exists. that’s unethical and despicable.
a fact is a fact whether you say it a-priori or otherwise. the focus is not to prove he is the best man. if you want to, you can try. but no one can prove that LHL is the best.
you don’t need to be a lawyer to understand fundamental law concepts just as you don’t need to be an economist to understand simple demand and supply. so there’s no rude accusation, just plain simple application of a fundamental concept.
what we do here will not put him in the slightest harm. the entire nation’s governmental organs are protecting him, even the newspapers, what has he to fear?
in conclusion, proving nepotism is not even the case to begin with. but allegation of nepotism is and the onus is on LHL who is making the allegation to prove his case. justice is not served when the allegation of nepotism is upheld when there never was any such allegations.
our PM is wonderfully adept at causing so many hardships and troubles for our country ever since he is in charge. he is universally considered to be brilliant only in the field of math and an idiot in all else. his supposed creative, long term solutions has resulted in untold hardships of late which should be obvious even to you. he brings happiness only to himself and supposed loyal citizens who are in actual fact just loyal to him and his party but not loyal to the country or to singaporeans.
what has he done? depending on how you look at it, a big fat zero or an F9.
achieving a lot doesn’t mean that you are therefore clean. you can achieve a lot with nepotism.
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Decades of elitist policies sidestepping the mass and grass roots resulted in full scale civil war now in Thailand. Not that Singapore citizens would be as daring and politically connected as the Red Shirts in Thailand but PAP should take it as a wake up call not to pursue at citizens’ expense their prolonged elitist policies and should be smarter by carefully reforming their own apparatus and most of all, tell their old man to just leave instead of disgracing himself further to the eyes of Singaporeans and the world…
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@PAP
Do the Americans worship their president and appoint his son to be the next president in post depression? What are you talking about? Without the road sweeper, all of us will be sick with diseases, do we worship the road sweeper?
We paid millions to PAP to have Singaporeans displaced.
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To truly singapore.
Firstly don’t get personal. It is not necessary for you to start your thesis to accuse me of somethng which i didnt say. Read the first para of your post 2.56 again and judge whether you owe me an apology or not.
Back to the point. I noted your additional point that since LHL jointly sued with his father, then the statement of Ng Kok Lim is sensible. You have to bear in mind that NG did not state this fact as you did. He just rattled off with what the father did, and then said “if you believe your father…” Your approach is acceptable, but not Ng’s because he missed the fact that it was a joint suit father and son. How could an unbiased reader without those historical facts, know?
Now on charlie rose. Don’t kid me, you said “the article implies nepotism when it obviously doesn’t”. Only 3 year old could believe that the charlie rose article/interview isn’t implicating some form of nepotism. Whether it is or it is not nepotism, is a different issue, but for sure there is some definite objective of Charlie Rose.
Now you also disagree that the focus is to prove “best man”. First take a look at the dictionary. Nepotism means putting UNFAIR advantage via family or other connections. Unfair means the person is lousy, you put him there. Fair means he is very good, perhaps the best, so you put him there. If a person is good and you purposely dont give him the chance then you are also being unfair… the point of Lee Hsien Loong is simply, “i am really very very good you know, no one better then Lee Hsien Loong”. If his statement is correct, then by the dictionary definition of nepotism, it is definitely not nepotism. We have to be logical, not emotional.
(For that matter, i absolutely do not believe he is the best man for the reasons which you already elaborated and for many other reasons. The corollary of this statement, you can conclude)
In your 2nd post, you also made another declaration that there “there never was any such allegations (of nepotism)”. For me it was very clear what the american media was trying to implicate. There is no other reason for bringing up this entire discussion. As i said, whether indeed it is fact of fiction is a different matter. For the other leaders like Kim Il Jong, they have no problem, call it nepotism, it’s ok. They know it they accept it, they couldn’t heck care. No need to waste time with law suits. Kim Il Jong in that respect, is much more of a gentleman.
Finally you said that the Ng Kok lim’s statement “That shows your basic ignorance of the basic law concept” is not rude.
Well then, may i say to you, “The fact that you started off with personal remarks on me shows your basic ignorance of debating skills and speaking etiquette”. It is not rude, I suppose.
zero
PS> To take on the PAP is not easy. Ng kok lim made a good try but it could have been better. I have nothing against him actually dont misunderstand.
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@truly singapore:
May 19, 2010 at 8:43 pm
“our PM is wonderfully adept at causing so many hardships and troubles for our country ever since he is in charge. he is universally considered to be brilliant only in the field of math and an idiot in all else. his supposed creative, long term solutions has resulted in untold hardships of late which should be obvious even to you”
How true,what you wrote above.
Sad to say but I agree completely with you.
All the recent socio-economic problems are the ‘BRILLIANT’ doing of supposedly SMART A-LIST scholars.
The conclusion we can draw from all these sad episodes that have befallen onto ordinary honest hardworking singaporeans-some of whom have no way out and decided to end their lives-is that mere ACADEMIC EXCELLENCE, based on so-called MERITOCRACY,is not(is not) the same as REAL INTELLIGENCE and true WISDOM.
Meritocracy breeds selfishness and selfishness breeds FOOLISH PRIDE.
Fellow countrymen,it is time to bring some WISODM back- like those exhibited by the OLD GUARDS-into Parliament.
VOTE WISELY.
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zero,
what is post 2.56? the posts are not labelled.
state the apology that i owe you and explain why. nothing personal please.
but LHL and his father has always sued newspapers together. that is common knowledge. so you don’t need to be an unbiased reader to know that. you just need to be reasonably aware of current affairs.
you must be a three year old indeed to believe that an allegation that there was nepotism is therefore true. prove to me if you want to make the accusation that nepotism was indeed insinuated or you have no right to say that nepotism was insinuated.
and it wasn’t the charlie rose article, it was the IHT article.
no that’s not the right interpretation. if unfair means lousy, then fair means not lousy. but not lousy doesn’t mean good or best. not lousy simply means not lousy. you can be average and still be not lousy.
since you have not even proved the allegation of nepotism, you cannot even go on to talk about not fair not giving a chance to someone who is supposedly ‘good’. so we have to be logical, and logically speaking, you have no case. emotional or othewise.
never mind it is clear to you what was being implicated, prove it. if you simply can’t prove the allegation of neportism, you have no right to refer to it as though it is a fact.
there are many documentaries that show interesting things that compare this and that based on facts. do you ask them for a reason for making those documantaries? you don’t. someone found it interesting and like to share it with others. i found the facts in the IHT article interesting. so that is good enough reason in and of itself.
but so many other asian nations are in the list. are you saying that all these asian nations are being ridiculed to be like kim jong ll? yet they too couldn’t care less. all the other asian nations couldn’t care less. it didn’t bother them. they have nothing to prove. they have no guilt. what does LHL have to prove?
if you can be rude to the author, then i suppose you wouldn’t mind getting a taste of your own medicine. if you cannot even stomach that, then don’t call yourself a gentleman. if you can commit the same basic ignorance of debating skills and speaking etiquette, don’t expect others to be kind to you.
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Singaporean Singaporean, I look down on 66.6% of you.
Not only you have no guts to fight for yourself, you put your next generation in the same shit hole, the government you voted in for the past 40 years, will displace you and the generations after you by opening the flood gate for ” FT ” to come in and take over your jobs, your school, your business, your housing and finally your nation.
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A well written article.
In fact, it’s just marvellous, Mr Ng.
Good work.
Now it’s time for you to beware of the ISD.
I hear they always come banging on your door only after 2am so when you open the door, you’re always half-asleep and not thinking clearly and you let them in.
Hence, prepare a golf club behind your door. And some sharp knives.
Good luck.
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To truly Singapore,9.18pm post
I do not know if you are serious or not, when i said “post 2.56″ it means 2:56pm post, any seasoned blogger would know. You posted two times. The first one was at 2.56 pm. The starting paragraphs are rude. Just as rude as Ng Kok Lim’s last paragraph to the Prime Minister. Here it is, you conveniently forget what you had written?
QUOTE orignating from Truly Singapore addressed to zero:
May 19, 2010 at 2:56 pm
if find your rebuttal very badly written. but perhaps because you think you write well even though you write badly, you may misconstrue a piece of good writing as bad writing because it differs so greatly from yours. UNQUOTE
I said already, you should not start your essay attacking another perosn. I had never said “i write well”. Don’t put words into my mouth please. You can say I write nonsense, but you cannot say that I say that I write well, ‘cos that is putting words in my mouth. I offered some views of Ng Kok Lim’s article, and nowhere in my post did I use personal direct attacks, it was entirely opinion with supporting reasons. I was never ever rude to him in my post. you can check it out.
I read the rest of your message and I just don’t wish to comment any further.
You need to know first of all, that I am not pro-LHL. But to deal with LHL, the standards of the message of NKL artilce is still far far behind. PAP will crush him with the tip of their little toes, if this is the kind of rebuttal that is available. Maybe you should go to SDP website. CSJ’s articles are really solid and class. That is why PAP is scared of him.
Let us observe “cooling off period”, my friend “Truly Singapore”. Let other people make some observations.
zero
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errata
sorry i mean “penultimate paragraph” not “last paragraph”
quote:
Just as rude as Ng Kok Lim’s PENULTIMATE paragraph to the Prime Minister. Here it is, you conveniently forget what you had written?
unquote
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errata
sorry i mean “penultimate paragraph” not “last paragraph”
quote:
Just as rude as Ng Kok Lim’s PENULTIMATE paragraph to the Prime Minister. unquote
zero
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When parents do well. Son do well. Now how many of us are struggling to make it to bring up the best of our family members. Yet, are we given the chances?
The hatred among all of us now is that we worked our s off yet what had happened?
Look at the educational sector and the job market. Who is getting our jobs? Is time to question.
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zero,
i’m serious, you are the only one here who writes 2.56 and expects people to know it’s 2.56pm. in fact, i hardly find anyone here who refers to timings. the odd few who do actually specify the full timings. this platform shows very well that yours is not a seasoned practice, thus not any seasoned blogger would know.
i find the starting paragraph not rude at all. it has the exact same meaning as what you wrote in your opening paragraph. so if you think it is rude, then it means you have been rude too. as for mr ng’s last paragraph, that is just facts. it may be rude to you, but it is not rude to many others who recgonise it simply as fact.
yes you should not start your wrting attaching another person. so when you did that, you are asking to be attacked in turn. so don’t blame others since you opened the first salvo. blame yourself for your own rudeness.
yes you never said you write well, that’s why i said perhaps you think you write well. perhaps doesn’t mean is. so i did not say you write well. i said perhaps you write well.
whether you are rude to another it’s not up to you to judge. the most cruel criminal may not think he is in the wrong. the most rude road rage may think he is in the right. in my opinion, you have been rude and used personal attacks without good supporting reasons.
any proof to show that the PAP is scared of CSJ? or is it another opinion of yours? are you again mistaking opinion for fact?
whether CSJ’s articles are solid or not is a matter of perspective. to his supporters he may be solid. but to many others, including many non-partisan singaporeans, CSJ is nonsense. i am not saying CSJ is nonsense. i am saying that because of his mis-steps early in his political career, he has just about completely destroyed his credentials in the eyes of the ordinary singaporean. i have heard so many times from ordinary, non-partisan singaporeans that they would vote for WP and chiam see tong. but they would never vote for CSJ.
that’s how bad the situation is for him and first impressions last forever. it may take 30 years before a new generation of voters grow up with no preconceived ideas of him to accept him.
sadly, that’s how things are.
i don’t think we’re so heated to begin with. i have experienced worse. the worst kind of silly taunts always come from the pro-PAP camp. i don’t know why, but somehow the worst behaviours always come from them, especially when they run out of excuses to give.
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If PM LHL really believe for ONE MINUTE that he was elected to be the PM based on his OWN MERIT, then to shut the mouth of all DAFT SInkaporeans up once and for all, he should:
1. Ask MM LKY to resign and retire.
2. Call for an IMMEDIATE ELECTION.
3. Contest in a SINGLE SEAT ward.
If he is elected and the CEC reappoint him as the PM, then all Sinkaporeans should SHUT THE FCUK UP!
Anyone disagree?
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ex-singaporean was being sarcastic. for all those who replied to ex-singaporean and didn’t “get it”: learn how to recognize sarcasm because you look foolish.
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Indeed, Ng Kok Lim’s is an excellently written piece save for two points:
a) he appears to regard LHL’s parentage as a demerit point, and
b) he has no idea of how the law of defamation applies.
I will not debate the first point – after all, Kok Lim is a free man and is certainly entitled to present his personal view, which he has done exceedingly clearly and with great wit.
However, he is wrong on the ‘defamation’ aspect.
To use an example: let’s imagine that A said “B is a monkey” and also that B sues A for defamation. In the vast majority of the world’s countries, the onus of proof is on A to prove his words are true. Since, in defamation cases, truth (called justification) is the ultimate defence, A can win the suit merely by proving that B is indeed a monkey.
(Two other defences are available in Singapore – the first is ‘privilege’ and the other is ‘fair comment’. Yet another defence – the ‘Reynolds’ defence – has been ruled inapplicable in Singapore.)
In this particular context, the International Herald Tribune was obliged to prove in court that its words (alluding to LHL’s parentage as a prime reason for his elevation to the post of Prime Minister) were true. It’s also worth noting that the IHT need not have explicitly stated such an allegation for the Lees to sue them for libel. It was simply enough that you or I understood the IHT’s words to possess such a meaning.
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“B is a monkey”
How to prove. Real monkey or just venting out anger on some skunk (another thing to prove). ultimately, it is still subject to the liking of the judge.
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meritocracy my ass, i am top 10% student and am more hard working and capable than most of my classmate, then i sign on. now my ft friend from indonesia who got Bs and Cs got better life and me jobless.
Singapore’s system is based on where you are born, are your background privilege or not.
they are not my government, i did not even get to vote, they just walk over and fuck my citizen rights.
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TheObserver,
a) at no point in mg ng’s writing did he refer to LHL’s parentage as a demerit point. on what basis do you make that assertion?
b) there is nothing wrong with his understanding of the fundamental law concept of innocent until proven guilty. that fundamental law concept applies to all laws, including defamation laws. if singapore’s defamation laws do not conform to this basic concept, it means singapore’s defamation laws are not based on principle.
your analogy does not adequately depict the situation at hand. let’s improve your analogy so that it fits the situation at hand. A says monkeys eat bananas. A also says that gorillas eat bananas, orang utans eat bananas and humans also eat bananas. A fellow human, say B, on hearing this accuses A of implying that humans are monkeys.
so yes, since A said something to beging with, the onus is on A to prove that what he said is correct. do monkeys eat bananas? yes. do gorillas, orang utans and humans eat bananas? yes, yes, yes. so the truthfulness of what A said can be readily and easily verified. no one, not even the judge will find any falsehood in what A said.
next, since B is interpreting what A said and in turn accusing A of intending to say something else instead, the onus is therefore on B to prove that that something else indeed was said. A did not say categorically that humans are monkeys. it was B who claims that A has said or implied that humans are monkeys. therefore the onus is on B to prove his claim.
applying the concepts to the IHT case, IHT wrote many examples of political dynasties in Asia. yes, the onus will be on IHT to prove that all these examples of polotical dynasties are true and not made up. this of course can be easily verified. they are all true cases of political dynasties. nothing was made up.
next, having established that all the examples that IHT quoted at true and nothing but true, we need to recognise that it was the LHL who then chooses to interpret what was being written and then claim that nepotism has been alleged. the crux of this case is the alleged nepotism which is a claim made by LHL, not IHT. since the claim of alleged nepotism was made by LHL to begin with, the onus therefore lies with LHL to prove that his claim is indeed true. the onus therefore lies with LHL to prove that his allegation is indeed true. and if he cannot even prove that his allegation is true, he cannot sue IHT for defamation.
we can easily do a survey of readers to find out who thinks that nepotism is alleged in the article. chances are, most readers will simply take the article at face value and accept the message that there are many political dynasties in asia, nothing more. to read deeper into the article and see things that aren’t even there to begin with would be the fault of the reader, not the writer’s.
sadly, many people can’t even apply basic law concepts correctly, not even lawyers themselves.
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“Truly singapore”, please don’t make a sweepin statement “chances are, most readers will ….”.
i said my piece before. the americans are alleging nepotism, by the simple fact that they mentioned about the other nepotic administrations and then zooming in to question on Singapore’s case. The insinuation of “aren’t you also like them” are so clear in the american message.!!! Don;t kid yourself, “truly Singapore”.
Let me repeat my stand. Nepotism means giving unfair advantage to somebody who is not fit and doesnt do justice to the job undertaken.
If LHL is really best as according to his own boastful declaration, we can’t say it is nepotism. Suppose that LHL created immense wealth and won 100000 billion investments, flattend the income gap, created strong sense of hope for the destitute, leveled the plyaing field in singapore, eradicated poverty and unemployoment without recourse to influx of foreigners, and nothing could be better. Then do you still call it nepotism? It can’t be if the person is really good and does so much good for the country.
But If he is NOT best, he bungled in so many unforgivable sequences, then it is nepotism. WE go along these lines, it is easy to distinguish truth from fiction. Follow the grain of LHL’s argument, you will win it. Go against it and you argue forever.
zero
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zero,
it’s not really a sweeping statement because of the added phrase “chances are”. chances are means probably, not that it is. which is why it is recommended that a survey be made.
no, it was LHL who alleged nepotism, not IHT. your supposed ‘fact’ that they mentioned other nepotic administrations and then zooming in on singapore’s case is not true. Lee’s case was just one of many mentioned in the earlier part of the article. it was followed by more detailed descriptions of several dynasties like India’s, Japan’s and so on but never about Lee. In fact, the only mention on the Lees was a short “Singapore’s Lee Hsien Loong is Lee Kuan Yew’s son”. so your alleged ‘fact’ is no fact but myth or worse still lie.
readers of TR, you can see very clearly here the same modus operandi at work. the insinuation of “aren’t you also like them” was clearly made by zero. never once was it insinuated by anyone else. so he, just like LHL did, was simply putting words in other people’s mouths. so don’t kid yourself zero, the message is clear. you and your LHL way of putting words in other people’s mouths and then claiming that they said it when they never did. that’s down right despicable.
let me repeat my reminder to you. unless you can prove it, you have no right to claim that nepotism has been alleged.
furthermore, your definition of nepotism is flawed. advantage yes. unfair probably. but unfit and not doing justice to the job undertaken is never in the definition of nepotism. nepotism is simply favouritism.
actually, even if he has created immense wealth and so on, it still doesn’t prove that he is the best, only that he has done a good job. doing a good job doesn’t mean you are therefore the best person for the job. because we will never know if another person filling his shoes wouldn’t do even better, no matter how incrementally small the betterment may be.
Thus, we need not go along the lines that he isn’t the best to prove nepotism. because our idea to begin with is not to prove nepotism. but to make people understand that the allegation of nepotism wasn’t even implied to begin with and if LHL thinks otherwise, the onus is on him to prove it.
so even if we go along your argument, we will still be arguing forever because if he can deny one thing, he can deny another.
so the important thing is not to go along his arguments because doing so would mean you have already conceded valuable ground to begin with. you would have conceded that nepotism has been alleged when it has not been. the important thing is to always adhere ourselves to correct principles. what is wrong is wrong and our job is to point it out. as long as we can win the hearts and minds of citizens with true and consistent application of fundamental principles, we would have won over the liberty of singapore.
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To truly singapore,
i really marvel at how you play with words.
“Chances are” means that you believe that the probability is higher than 50. “Chances are that it will rain tomorrow”. “Chances are if you conduct a survey most people will think zero is useless stupid moron”.
These are all sweeping statements. You and i don’t know what people think of you and I.
I don’t wish to comment on all the rest of your post, i said before, let others say something.
zero
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The PAP is the government of the day. The majority of the electorate has so decided. The PAP machinery had picked LHL as the PM. What is ever so wrong about this?
LHL was selected PM by the Cabinet – not LKY.
Chiam See Tong is now grooming his wife to take over his constituency. Isn’t this a tard presumptious? Hey, here in Singapore, don’t we put this to the electorate to decide? Is Chiam setting up his own dynastic campaign? Come, come!
Joshua Benjamin Jeyaretnam’s son at RP – isn’t he perpetuating JBJ’s politcial legacy?
Dr Chee Soon Juan & his politcal wannabe.. sister. I don’t hear accusation of dynastic intentions?
Are Singaporeans a bunch of spineless hypocrites?
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zero,
you don’t have to marvel at simple understanding of common english. “chances are it will rain tomorrow” is not a statement but a prediction. “chances are” means there is a chance, not that the chance will be more than 50%. so they are not sweeping statements but predictions. you don’t have to play around with words, just understand and use words as they really are.
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Mad Hatter,
don’t be mistaken please. the issue at hand is not about political dynasty per say. we all know that the article by IHT is indeed about political dynasties and people reading the article will get the idea that political dynasties are actually very common, at least in asia. so there’s nothing wrong with that and that isn’t the issue.
the issue is that someone has written about political dynasties which is harmless but LHL has made an issue out of it by claiming that it is actually an insinuation on nepotism. that is the thing which is terribly wrong and our courts have allowed it to pass. it goes fundamentally against the basic concept of innocent until proven guilty.
i remember reading a story that happened during the cultural revolution in china. can’t remember exactly but some artist painted a cat and the red guards came knocking and found fault with that. because cat in chinese is pronounced as ‘mao’, they therefore claimed that the painting is an insult to chairman ‘mao’.
this story succinctly explains what is terribly wrong with what has happened here. someone has innocently drawn a cat. nothing more. but the red guards have stormed in and claimed that it is an insult on chairman mao. where is the justice? where is the presumption of innocence? you mean LHL can suka suka claim whatever that i have written to mean something else or anything else that he so fancies so that he can acccuse me of whatever he thinks i am writing about when actually i have not? shouldn’t the onus be on him to claim whatever he feels is being implied?
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to mad hatter
As a matter of fact, nepotism means giving someone UNFAIR advantage. If Chiam See Tong’s wife is very very dynamic,intelligent and creative, i can’t see it as an unfair advantage, because she earned her place. Same thing goes for KJ-JBJ and CSJ’s sister. As long as a person earns her place and proves himself/herself IT IS NOT nepotism – because the definition of nepotism is not merely confined to favouritism along family ties. It is performance based.
That is why i say that is is completely meaniningless if you want to “prove” nepotism simply with a one dimensional view asking whehter this guy is a relative of that guy. That is the whole point Lee Hsien Loong is trying to tell us, and for that i agree with him.
Many people end up being sued for nothing because they try the old ways without even understanding what is nepotism. They are so dumb they never learn that it never pays to say “LHL got his job through connections”. THAT IS THE WRONG APPROACH. We need to focus : is he the BEST man, is he doing good job? If he is not the best man, if he is a bungler and follower and not a good leader, then the corollary is obvious. He himself acknolwedged such ideas.
The best way to settle this once and for all is for him to stand alone in elections and let the voters decide.
zero
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the Parliament should legislate an Act to declare the old man Supreme Leader and Eternal President.
Call an Ace an Ace and a Spade a Spade.
Bow down to the man.
Better yet, why not simply make the old man the Prime Minister also?
I am sure he can do a better job.
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a wise man once told me that we can’t hate them and we can’t love them either.
either we strive to overhaul the whole system, or we make it work for our own benefit. ideally it starts from home, then the community, then country. IDEALLY. but idealism doesn’t apply here i suppose. perhaps not yet. a complete overhaul over a short period of time will strain the country and we could just simply collapse. perhaps a reasonable timeframe with realistic targets/objectives over a longer period of time is more suitable.
in my opinion, we are too young a nation to even have a proper power to the people. what we can do now is to make the best out of the situation and work towards having a better future for our children. change will never happen in the next election, or the one after that. or better still, a change catalyst might appear one day as the next big thing with the next big idea appearing with his/her own charisma on his/her own standing.
creativity and innovation is now in high regard. that’s a good start. we start at home, and then perhaps the community. and if we live to see it, that “getting rid of all the bad vibes in our land”. it’s a good foundation actually. apply creativity and innovative thinking to not only creating products but also new ideas on sustaining our country and it’s economy with no ’strings attached’.
if we live to see it, good. and if we don’t, at least there is a legacy for our children/grandchildren to work on. we now have our minds set on something, but it’ll come gradually as long as we keep our intentions sincere and our objectives in sight.
heck, for all i know, it could be the same brand ruling but a better way of doing it. a better kind of PAP? why not. a different ruling party who does it better? why not. for as long as it treats the CITIZENS as valued assets and not some expendable commodity, you have my vote.
because, a vote is not for me or my ego or my angst or my frustrations. it will be for the future of our children.
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