A Muslim Singaporean to Lee Kuan Yew
January 27th, 2011 | 
Author: 
He urged us Muslims to be less strict? We urge him to go and die.
Who the hell this fella thinks he is? He is one stupid human being who will die anytime and he tells us Muslims to be less strict? Is he my God, a Prophet, a companion or a descendant of our last Prophet, a ulama or a Ustad?
NONE OF THE ABOVE!
Hey LKY, listen. Whether I, my family or my siblings are good Muslims or strict ones at which level of piousness, is none of your bloody business. You did not create me nor you were asked by God to tell me what and how I should be as a Muslim. Who you or your family prays and what you eat, drink and do is your business. We Muslims don’t give a hoot. So, you mind your own business. We have our own books of guidance from the Al-Quran, the Hadiths and all other books from the great Islamic teachers, past and present.
We will seek and obey Allah’s laws and guidance, not yours or your puppets in MUIS. We have also been warned of people like you and there is one verse in the Al-Quran that describes people with your thinking – “Surah Al-Kafirun”. Ask the dummy head in MUIS, the Mufti, to read and describe the translation to you. This verse has in-depth meaning but in short, it tells both the Muslims and the non-Muslims that they are free to practise what they believe in, AND, that they can all live in harmony, side by side.
The Singapore’s MUIS and Mufti are all a laughing stock. If our new Mufti has any pride in his religion or fears God, he will dispute and correct you in what you said, without fear or hesitation. But we Muslim Singaporeans have seen this over and over again with MUIS and Muftis, one after another. All of them are just dummy heads of PAP. So, we don’t expect them to say anything.
Next, are intermarriages a problem in Islam? Don’t lie old man. Do you think you can fool everyone all the time? All Muslims are brothers or sisters and there is no distinction is colour of the skin or race. No one man is superior to another and all colours are equal. Ask the Mufti to relate to you what the last Prophet said in his last sermon. If intermarriages were a problem in Islam, how did Islam spread to the nations like China, South Asia, South East Asia, and now US and South America? Your supposedly well educated brain is a bird brain? Oh, one more thing, your theory of “a good mare with a dud stallion = a poor foal“. You preached this in the 1980s and now you preach it again. So, you are a good PM huh? What about your mother and father? What breed were they? PMs too? Are your grandparents PMs too? So, your son has cancer? Based on your theory of genetics, the cancer genetically must be from you, your deceased wife, your parents or hers? And your albino grandson? Will anyone marry him? Are you calling your grandson a dud stallion?
Back to the issue of discussion, are you asking Muslim Singaporeans to be less “strict” in our faith so that we can support your vices like gambling and prostitution which you have brought into this nation? Singapore is fast becoming a “sin” city, no longer the “singa” city. You want to see our Muslims to be called Muslims for namesake only but not in practice like those in USSR? You want mosques to be only showpieces so as to show people that we have mosques and that we have Muslims but they don’t pray, don’t fast and don’t read the Al-Quran?
LKY, nobody is asking for your views on Muslim faith. If we want to, we will ask you. But than again, you are not worth a penny for us to ask you on this issue of faith. You are not a Muslim. You are not inside Islam to know what is inside of Islam and not being inside Islam means you are outside of Islam. So, how can you comment on what is inside Islam?
You see LKY, believe it or not, God already knows you before you know yourself, for he created you when you were a sperm swimming inside your dad’s testicles. Your fate is already written just like how you cannot do anything to keep your wife alive forever. Likewise, you will not be alive forever. Death will come and only the Creator knows when your time is up. Your day will come and, most importantly, when you are close to your death and the Angel of Death appears before you to take your soul, two other angels will appear to ask you questions. Be worried. Be prepared. Be scared. It will be painful for you. Don’t waste your last few minutes or days or months worrying about us Muslims on how strict we should adhere to our faith. You should be worrying about yourself on how death is going to be like for you. There is no escape.
But you see, this will only be the beginning. With all the curses from so many Singaporeans, both Muslims and non-Muslims, these curses will bring you to Hell. Your death will be like those of the Pharaohs of Egypt. People will rejoice at your death. We Singaporeans will live to see this joyful occasion (you’ll be dead by then but your soul will probably see us Singaporeans rejoicing on that day). Your body will be eaten by worms (if buried) or burnt to ashes (if cremated).
I will defy you. My family will defy you. I will spread the message to all Muslim Singaporeans whom I know to defy you. I will spread the true word of Islam to my non-Muslim friends and that is, “live and let live and respect each other religions”. I will spread the word of racial harmony, intermarriages, etc to my Muslim and non-Muslim brothers and sisters.
So what are you going to do?
.
A Muslim Singaporean who has served his NS
Posted in Letters
MUIS to the Muslims is a big disgrace,
They aren’t independent in the first place,
Because they got appointed by the PAP’s grace,
So the PAP they will naturally want to embrace,
They are only good at tying Kuan Yew’s shoe lace,
To the PAP they’ll sell their religion and race,
They work according to their master’s policy and pace,
They deserve shoes thrown at their face.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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Lee Kuan Yew is right! Enjoy it while it last Singaporean, we have all lost it! It takes forever to change mindset, and with the kind of mindset our generation has, dark clouds are upon us, enjoy it while it last! What a shame! What a contribution, attacking the person instead of the issue, you must be out of your mind! What a shame!!!
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Bro,
Relax. Don’t need to incite so much hate. It is not the Muslim way. Though it is good to speak up against this, because to be honest, Mr Lee is talking nonsense.
Justice will come (as a result of our actions, I must add), and if it doesn’t then well Islam and Christianity clearly state that salvation comes in the hereafter, not on this Earth anyway.
So yeah, peace out because being angry is counterproductive anyway.
Salam.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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Dear People,
My worry right now is precisely the Mufti, PAP Malay leaders, Malay NGO’s (who are all PAP controlled) etc – what is their response to this ?
If MUIS keeps quiet – then MUIS will lose all credibility and trust.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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We will seek and obey Allah’s laws and guidance, not yours or your puppets in MUIS.
We have also been warned of people like you and there is one verse in the Al-Quran that describes people with your thinking – “Surah Al-Kafirun”.
Ask the dummy head in MUIS, the Mufti, to read and describe the translation to you.
This verse has in-depth meaning but in short, it tells both the Muslims and the non-Muslims that they are free to practise what they believe in, AND, that they can all live in harmony, side by side.
The Singapore’s MUIS and Mufti are all a laughing stock.
If our new Mufti has any pride in his religion or fears God, he will dispute and correct you in what you said, without fear or hesitation.
But we Muslim Singaporeans have seen this over and over again with MUIS and Muftis, one after another.
All of them are just dummy heads of PAP.
So, we don’t expect them to say anything.
””””””””””””””””””””””””’
“A MAN OF GOD IS FULL OF FAITH”
………………………………………….
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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Well said.
A Singaporean Muslim abroad sent me that TR posted LKY blooper. Let KuanYew fool himself and lose the crowd. And Singaporeans abroad are making time and effort to see how they can make a difference for regime change this GE and future GEs–will never give up until this deed is done.Yay!
He thinks he is a god–because PAP kowtow to this ancestor.
We should work towards changing the law for the Singaporean Overseas Vote (SOE). It might not happen this GE, but a campaign like this can sustain an educational programme for change in electoral laws.
SOE! SOE!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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Fuck the bastard old man, the old fart, aged 87-years who thinks that he is very superior and knowledgeable in this world. He is just only a lawyer by training and uses the laws to fuck around and do the evil things. Such a man who call himself MM, [the Minister of Mentor.] who is supposed to be very wiseman and super intelligent being can anyhow say such things. Yet, he expects all the native Singaporeans to respect him as a supreme being. My foot to you, old fart.
Old fart, if you have no knowledge of whorld religions I advise to shut up your filthy mouth. If there is any religious riot and upheaval, you are to blame first. Go to trace back the past history of religious wars which are happened from time to time. And until now, there are still some religious war going on. Can you understand me, idiot old fart since you are the world famous leader who is well known?
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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MM Lee and his Hard Truth on Muslim.
If he became a converted Muslim, chance of Muslims listening to him on becoming less strict would be more acceptable to them.
If not, it would be like wax mixing with water.
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MODS, how about toning down this picture here with another?
this note is an indication of what happens and what the outcome will be like when seemingly righteous men in the pulpits fail to act in the face of hardships inflicted grossly by some on her fellowmen.
will singapore go the way of tunisia, egypt and yemen and others?
sincerely said, this time, lky has gone a bit far out on this issue.
had he said what he said in indonesia or malaysia or the philippines in front of the quarter billion muslims, lky will be hell-bound.
no christian in his right mind will allow a non-christian to “attack” his church.
even mahatma gandhi could not persuade the hindus and the muslims within his indian sub-continent to come together nor had he ever tried to secularise their religions.
remember, gandhi , even today , some fifty years after his death , is venerated throughout india as a saint by many.
why invite such a response or vitriol when it is uncalled for, lky?
why , muis and mufti, did you not respond in any way to this generally malay dilemna much earlier?
a response will now appear to be mandatory to allay any further erosion of your peoples’ faith in you.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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I am Singaporean Chinese and I am angry too. FUCK U LKY.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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Firstly, whatever LKY said out of ignorance you should be able to pardon and move on. That is the way of Islam. It isn’t to incite such hate. Don’t start a tirade against one man who in fact has helped Singapore a lot since its Independence.
Secondly, if you are against a statement or a thought please feel free to target that and write as much as you want. We will support you for that. But your vulgar language and hate on a personal level shows your juvenile mind set as well as your lack of rational thought.
When you grow up please come forward to re-discuss these points and we will add to it and help you fight your fight.
Till then keep your thoughts to yourself.
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Well said!
Islam is a religion…..what does he meant be more or less strict?
Will he one day tell our all Muslims that Chicken is expension….let eat pork?
He should be arrested by the ISD to trying to sow discord among all Singaporeans….
Chinese, Indians and Malays have all been living in harmony…..we are buddies in the army…..and we see each other as fellow citizens and respect each others…..
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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are intermarriages a problem in Islam?
Don’t lie old man.
Do you think you can fool everyone all the time? All Muslims are brothers or sisters and there is no distinction is colour of the skin or race. No one man is superior to another and all colours are equal. Ask the Mufti to relate to you what the last Prophet said in his last sermon.
If intermarriages were a problem in Islam, how did Islam spread to the nations like China, South Asia, South East Asia, and now US and South America? …
Oh, one more thing, your theory of “a good mare with a dud stallion = a poor foal“. You preached this in the 1980s and now you preach it again.
So, you are a good PM huh? What about your mother and father? What breed were they?
PMs too?
Are your grandparents PMs too? So, your son has cancer?
Based on your theory of genetics, the cancer genetically must be from you, your deceased wife, your parents or hers?
And your albino grandson?
Will anyone marry him?
Are you calling your grandson a dud stallion?
Back to the issue of discussion, are you asking Muslim Singaporeans to be less “strict” in our faith so that we can support your vices like gambling and prostitution which you have brought into this nation?
Singapore is fast becoming a “sin” city, no longer the “singa” city. You want to see our Muslims to be called Muslims for namesake only but not in practice like those in USSR?
You want mosques to be only showpieces so as to show people that we have mosques and that we have Muslims but they don’t pray, don’t fast and don’t read the Al-Quran?
LKY, nobody is asking for your views on Muslim faith. If we want to, we will ask you…. You are not a Muslim…..
…………………………………………………………..
good lord, how did singapore arrive at this stage???????
””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””’
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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“The Singapore’s MUIS and Mufti are all a laughing stock”
MUIS and Mufti are useless…….you don’t need a Non-Muslim to tell how the religion should behave…..
Hope Ayatollah issue a fatwa on him……
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Seems to me that much of the criticism is blindly directed at the old man, and not the content of what he said.
I personally do not disagree with his comment that Islam is far more isolationist in its requirements of its believers than other religions, and this can be, and is, a barrier to integration with other members of society who are from other religions.
For example, marriage between a Muslim and a Buddhist cannot be achieved without one of them relinquishing their religion. Muslims are not allowed to give up their religion. So it would be either the non-Muslim converting to Islam, or the Muslim forgoing family and community ties as a consequence of relinquishing the faith. Either way, true integration does not take place.
Eating at the same communal table would be impossible for strict adherence of haram /halal standards without the non-muslim members agreeing to eat Halal. The reverse (i.e. Muslims agreeing to eat Haram food) is simply not possible. Again, integration is impeded.
Yes, there are parallels in other religions in food, marriage, etc., but none of them are quite as strict as Islam is with regards to consequence for disobedience. And one could even argue many people of these other religions are not as stringent in following their religious precepts either.
Perhaps if Muslims rebut the Old Man with facts and examples as to why he is wrong, rather than just baying for his damnation, the conversation would be more fruitful, and convincing.
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you are stoking the fire , my friend , with your reply which is not quite more mature than the author.
hold your peace too as much as you want him to.
keep your thoughts to yourself.
put on your stereo head-phones and listen to “imagine” from John Lennon or something.
stop stoking the fire.
you are of no great help here.
.
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Lately MSM keepings honouring him as “founding father”…..he has no shame…..since he didn’t against this naming, I suppose he think he deserve it….
Why ask cabinet to demolish his home after the die…..who is he? The house belong to him right? What he want to do with his home is up to him…and let this son to fulfill his wish…..
Why the cabinet has to spend public fund to demolish his house……
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[Quote: But your vulgar language and hate on a personal level shows your juvenile mind set as well as your lack of rational thought.]
Tracing back his past history, the old man has destroy alot of our native political opponents. Three generations of our native political members are already destroyed by him.
I am fearful that he will do it again onto the fourth generation. Besides that he and his son, PM have messed up our country into haywire where alot of natives are jobless.
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On 2nd thought, I think he is trying to test the public sentiment….he want to build a Memorial Hall for himself like Taiwan Chiang Kai-Shek….depicting his success and books……..and be put in a glass coffin for public display like China Lao Mao….
Better remove the iconic Merlion with his statue……..poo!
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LKY thinks he is the smartest in the world. In the leaks he said the North Korean leader craves for adulation. He is actually describing himself. He lights up with a smug when the spotlight is on him. See his facial expressions and body moves when he speaks, he thinks he is a prophet, Einstein, Leonardo da Vinci, Churchill all roll into one.
What is now happening are signs of desperations.
They sense they are going to have a really tough time this coming election.
So the only way to win the important majority Chinese votes is to apply the same old tactics of creating distrust and fear.
We only hope our Chinese brothers do not fall into the trap.
SINGAPOREANs of all races get on very well on the ground. The same goes for Malaysians too. We are all from the human race.
The politicians are the ones that stir things up to suit their own plans and agenda. LKY knew full well how the reactions will be like. Yet he did it. He must be truly desperate.
Things will get more and more nasty now as LKY’s diarrhea gets worst.
Please alert everybody.
Do not be fooled this time.
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@47 MP
He’s going to demolish his home and sell that piece of prime land at ridiculously high above-market price to the government (taxpayers money of course). And of course since he’s the government, he will approve the purchase.
We are going to get screwed again!
Remember: LEE CONNED YOU!
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I am looking at the several comments to the posting:
1. Is this a PAP govt position? What is LKY in PAP? A senile PAP politician or does he set the tone/policy on rights of minorities to religion etc a “cultural life” (under Art 15 ICESR) as senior whatchamacallit? If he sets the tone then the party whip will ensure obedience. If he has no official business in dictating the policy, then MPs can distance themselves if they dont want to lose votes/cause ire among minority Muslims.
So if its official–MUIS is a govt set up and Yaacob is an PAP MP–there is NOTHING different that you can expect from this sad lot.
2. But what is the role of the MUIS/Mufti is advising policy makers and PAP? Obviously they have no real role from their silence since inception on atrocities and infringements of human rights of this minority community. This is the AMLA role. So I suggest dont give any more support and dont pay your zakat to MUIS if you think that they have been clueless as civil servants and did not even fulfil their designated AMLA role. This is what every individual can do. You have off course to figure out–what about funds to madrassah education. But that should be another strategy to work on.
3. I think there should still be an official clarification on LKY in PAP with regard to this statement.
If you check Tun M since retired from some 22 years of helming Malaysia—the politicians are quite clear about his statements and the government’s official policy and they will clarify that OR their journos are always checking their politicians anyway.
But the fact that LKY has been PM forever and now through his son…… PAP is LKY and vv.
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It’s called don’t screw around with others’ religions!
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Once a muslim friend of mine who had a beard was called up for NS. While he was willing to do the military service but wanted to retain his beard which is very essential in Islam. He went to MUIS enlisting their help and asking them to support his request to retain his beard while doing NS. His rationale is that “the Sikhs are allowed to retain their beard and turbans in NS. So why are we muslims not allowed to keep our beard.” Of course the pro PAP MUIS would not have none of it and let him down miserably.
I remember the other incident some years back when muslim school girls who wore tudung(head scarves) to school were not allowed to and had to leave the school. This incident was reported in the press. Sadly MUIS and the so called “mufti” and the PAP malay MPs did not defend the school girls but instead supported the PAP’s stand.
So PAP, please don’t say there is religious freedom in Singapore.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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Dear Sir. They said that the truth always hurts. Based on the responses here and in Malaysia, I can see that Mr Lee is right in his comments and observations. Thank you.
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Looks like more votes lost to opposition again…
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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You preach “tolerance” and there you are…finally “exposing your inner thoughts”…and hoping to “Change Muslims Mind”.
Everytime I look at Mdm Harimau and Mr Jacobs Biscuit…they look like Puppets and Clowns to me ? What representation ? Virtually “talking for the sake of talking”…skirting and jumping around issues.
Abt Mufti ?..same,same.
And I am a Chinese …that finds it “intolerable” that the Minorities are “poorly” represented by “True ,Honest & Sincere at Heart for their People”..voicing out when necessary and pointing the views points through. ( Be Open & Candid )
Sadly, it has always seem like a “silent,tamed ,Mouth piece”
Yeah! Its correct to say..they are for “Show, show Only “.
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you sure have a warp mind !
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He was supposed to come to Woodlands Library for some event on 25 Feb 2011.
Now it has been cancelled. Aiyo.
This old man he had 1 and when on to have too many.
Silly old man, how can he ask people to be more or less religious.
Malays are socially ok, thats what matters to me. At times, I’ll give in if its reliogion and I am sure they would too.
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please TR no middle fingering publishing or those letters with expletives. you will put off civil readers and besides lead authorities to close this. 4 letter profanities will not give the writer respectability, just shows loss of self control.
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he was just trying to remove the opium of the people .
that way he can have a free fall all for himself.
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Lee Kuan Yew’s statement is half true because if you go and live in malaysia, then you’ll understand why.
Paradoxically, “Singaporean muslim who has served his NS”’s reaction has just proven Lee Kuan Yew’s statement. I doubt that LKY will be convinced anyway bcause he’s agnostic/atheist.
I think his statement is misunderstood. LKY meant that the singaporean muslims have to be less extreme and less overzealous in their ideology. What LKY had in mind was social harmony and stability. And he sees islamic fundamentalism as an obstacle.
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Dear Brothers and Sisters,
If we look at the root of these problems its with the PAP.
Vote them out, because absolute power corrupts
Am a non muslim, and I would say LKY is out of line by making such statements, funny how the Stale times can report such news, that is considered extremely sensitive.
What is the purpose? or is is like FART ?
Vote for opposition! Vote for Change
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Rev LKY has spoken
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Salam,Shalom,Peace be with all believers of the ALMIGHTY.
LKY was an Atheist turn Agnostic than a nominal Buddhist.In his last mile on Earth he was taught to seek PEACE of mind by reciting a mantra while he meditate ie “MARANATHA” the last word in the Holy Bible calling upon Lord Jesus to come.
The two things in life that true believer seek is PEACE of MIND and NO FEAR of DEATH when the time arrive for us to leave this world in peace.
LKY is seeking BOTH but to no avail when Satan holds his hands he has to UNSHACKLE his chains to receive BOTH that true believers ENJOY.
So seek not to condemn nor cures dear brothers of the BOOK but pity a Soul that is shackled.
Amen/Amin
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I’m Singaporean, Chinese, non-Muslim.
LKY says we’re not a nation because we won’t die for one another. Maybe, maybe not. We’ll know.
LkY, but we’ll definitely capable of speaking up for one another. Your dogs screwed up Thaipusam. You want to screw up Islam. Whose next?
You’re just trying to draw attention upon yourself. Draw attention away from your useless son, daughter-in-law and all their multi-billion screw-ups. We Singaporeans will show you what is a united nation when elections come. Singaporeans vs you.
Ed: do you think you can put a more respectable photo for a religious themed posting?
Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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typo error “curse” in place of “cure”
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Slimp Hwa-
Based on responses and comments here, I say Lee Kuan Yew is wrong.I wonder how the Chinese will react if Muslims start to make hurtful comments about them. Differently? Will they be sitting down for coffee with Muslims to reach consensus. I guess, the readers are right, LKY is propagating a hate Muslim campaign for non Muslim Singaporeans. You fell for it my friend.
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He is your God’s God.
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LKY, what happened to your policy on racial & religious harmony? We have to share HDB flats in equal ratio, share the school equally & even sports & jobs. Now you give the jobs available only to FTs & disbanded Singapore football team! Yet, you are telling us to lead our life just like Westerners (celebrating Christmas is one of the proof), telling Chinese to speak none other than Mandarin & English, telling Muslims (Malay & other ethnics) not to be strict & set rules for Indians (Tamil-speaking) on the way to celebrate Thaipusam! Anyway, my girlfriend is a Malay. I am afraid that next time, you may order Malay not to hold wedding under HDB flats (and your bad excuse is… The flat will collapse!). No vote for you during GE, PAP.
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I am a former PAP MP. I urge Muslims in Singapore to heed Mr. Lee Kuan Yew’s advise. Don’t become emotional. While we respect our religion we must also get real in life. Muslims nations are lacking behind non Muslims nations. Why go far? Just look at Malaysia. Ever since our nations separated, Singapore have always been one up against Malaysia in every spheres. In Singapore the Muslim have alot of catching up to do with the other races in all fields. Economically Musilms in Singapore are lagging behind the other races. See Mr. Lee’s statement in the right perspective. He is telling you to progress and he knows that our strict observance of Islam is one of the major cause of Muslim’ regressive state.
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i am not a muslim but i think what lky said is really sucks.
end for pap is near. instead of in repair mode for all their screwups before election, they are creating more controversies.
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IT IS “MUSLIMS” LIKE HIM THAT IS GIVING ISLAM AND THE UMMAH A BAD IMAGE
Hi dude! How does such disgraceful behaviour of yours go to help improve the already battered image of Islam and Muslims?
Every time the Muslim slanders and curses non-Muslims and their own Muslim people with lies, half-truths and distortionsm, the curses go to the disapproving Jesus Whom ALLAH had taken up to Heaven to be with Him (An-Nisaa 4:158) And then the curses and slanders got thrown back to the imprecators and they becom self-accursed.
Read my post belielow.
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Oi Yatiman!
U r asking for trouble is it? Pui!!!
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The problem with this old man is he thinks he know everything and he is the supreme god,sigh someone should really ask him tho keep his mouth shut ,whenever he opens it its all rubbish,whey don’t he just retire gracefully,can the pap cronies please put out a word to him for god sake for Singapore and fir true blue Singaporeans
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Dr Syed Alwi:
January 27, 2011 at 6:28 pm Dr Syed Alwi(Quote)
“Dear People,
My worry right now is precisely the Mufti, PAP Malay leaders, Malay NGO’s (who are all PAP controlled) etc – what is their response to this ?
If MUIS keeps quiet – then MUIS will lose all credibility and trust”.
My dear Dr Syed,
MUIS has lost the trust of ordinary muslims decades ago. It is not something that came out overnight. From one issues to another MUIS has been “obediently” quiet.
Even the Church leader Nicholas had bravely stand up to say his discontent when the government decided to build the casino. What about the tudung issue,the silence on insurance fatwa,and now someone with an unusually big mouth came out to decide it’s time Muslim should be less strict in their religion?
Of course when it was the case of Mas Selamat the muslims and non-muslims never expected the new Mufti to open up his mouth to comment but he did it anyway??? As if there is This ON green button…when to speak and when not to.
So your worries Dr Syed and ours are not the concern of MUIS or its leaders. They are answerable to their paymaster…in this case PAP.
Tonight let’s watch how the former mufti wriggle his way out explaining people’s discontent and hatred towards his 38 years in office. Such a sad episode in his life as a mufti BUT he should ask himself if he is true, how come the TRUST of the community do not come back to him??
There are many true Ulamas being imprisoned in islamic countries like Egypt,Tunisia,Saudi…etc…for speaking the truth. That’s the price of a true ULAMA. No favour no fear.
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WHAT IS REALLY BUGGING OUR ANGST-RIDDEN MM LEE KUAN YEW?
What MM Lee was trying to say is that many of our Muslims were/are often very unnecessarily strict in their islamic practices in the wrong way, and often majoring on the minors without the right rationale to make themselves look so ridiculous, such as on halal foods and tudong, etc, on the one hand. On the other, despising the transcendent beauty and virtues that can be found in their Quran. As a result, they often cause their own backwardness and problems, and then resorting to blame the non-Muslims for ‘causing’ their problems, and on their MUIS leaders for their sad state of affairs.
If they have/had got it right on when to be very strict with their islamic practices, then they wouldn’t need to falsely and maliciously accuse me for trying to promote “satanic verses” when it was the goodness in their Quran which many of you already knew I have been passionate in wanting to promote it over the years, even though I am a non-Muslim.
Such incurably upside-down mindset of our Muslims works against the attempts of our solicitous government at social integration and harmony. That is why islamic terrorism and extremism is here to stay with us forever, unless our Muslims are prepared to allow their leaders in MUIS and Islamic Affairs Minister to open up their closed minds and re-set their wrong thinking away from the backwardness and benightedness of the Middle Eastern. But their refusal to do so is perennially worrying our angst-ridden MM Lee to no end, a grave anxiety that all of us who love Singapore also sadly share.
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If opposition mention that they will allow muslims students to keep beard and ladies allowed to wear tudung I believe they will get atleast 95% of malay votes…
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I am a chinese, our local malays and indians are my brothers and i can relate to them…we go thru thick and think together and we all grow up in thie beloved land of ours with our blood sweat and tears
But Now the PAP is bringing in all the foreigner to undermine the stability in our country
They always tell us regardless of race language or religion, and to accept each other’s religions and beliefs…and i think over the last 30 years we have all done well, now Lee come and tell us this kind of cock statement..
Lee and his cronies are the ones breaking up our country and our spirit…i hope we can all unite as a nation and stand up to them and show them Singapore belongs to us Singaporeans and not belong to Lee and his million dollar lackeys!
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If any person other than LKY were to utter such a brainless remark against another religion in this country i am sure he would be behind bars by now…what a joke!
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BRAVO TO MR YATIMAN YUSOF!
May ALLAH bless you and your loved ones! Excellent counsel!!
I am not a PAP member. But Muslims are not being honest to themselves and read to many wrong things into what MM Lee said.
It can be easily proved that if Muslims ponder objectively what MM Lee recently said, it will uplift further the lives and thinking of Muslims and bring glory to ALLAH and the image of the Singaporean Ummah.
So I am re-posting my aticle below and I want Muslims to rebut me, if they can. If not, they must go to ALLAH too confess their sin (haram) and seek to straighten out their twisted thinking and life to live for the glory of ALLAH and their loved ones. That will be good enough.
Allahu Akbar! God is Greatest!
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WHAT DR SYED ALWI WROTE IS ESSENTIALLY WHAT MM LEE KUAN YEW MEANS BY INTEGRATION
An excellent and short post by this Singaporean Muslim scientist Dr Syed Alwi in Temasek Review on Unity in Diversity as the source of Singapore’s strength was made on January 24, 2011 at 2:53 pm. I fully agree with him. He wrote: “Forget Singaporean Singapore. Forget Malaysian Malaysia. Forget Ketuanan Melayu. Forget Ketuanan Islam. Look towards our Diversity as a source of strength [for Singapore]. Forget Confucian Supremacy.” That is the ideal for integration that MM Lee is really talking about, which must be centred on the quintessential in eclecticism.
Unfortunately, MM Lee has found many Muslims in Singapore still finding themselves spiritually challenged and finding difficulty to integrate. While non-Muslims like me think that the Quran and Islam’s other holy books are good for their integration, to help us unite in diversity (as Dr Syed Alwi puts it), the majority of the ‘moderate’ Muslims prefer silence instead of never failing to speak up boldly and unequivocally (and not leaving it to our Muslim leaders to do so) to challenge the Islamists and extremists who have hijacked Islam for their violent interpretation; who think their Quran and Hadiths are only good for making Muslims backward, with their violent and hence wrong teachings, not the good teachings therein which non-Muslims like me cherish.
That was why I was shocked that in recent months, Islamists had even falsely accused me in a local Internet forum of propagating “satanic verses” what goodness in the Quran I had/have been zealously trying to promote to help more Muslims to integrate and excel, such as the transcendentally beautiful Prayer of Prophet Suleiman: “Inspire me, Lord, to be thankful Thee for Thy favours to me and my parents to do good deeds which will please Thee. Admit me, through Thy mercy, to be among Thy righteous.” An-Naml 27:19. “For the noblest in ALLAH’s sight is he who is the most righteous.” Al-Hujurat 49:13.
“Return evil with good; then lo! he who is your enemy will become your bosom friend.” Fusilat 41:34. “Help one another in what is good and pious and not in what is wicked and sinful.” Al-Maida 5:2. “Lo! they who belong to the devil’s party are the losers….Lo! they who belong to ALLAH’s party are the successful ones.” Al-Mujadilah 58:19, 22. “ALLAH is with the righteous” At-Tauba 9:36. “For ALLAH loves and guides the righteous, not the evil-doers.” At Tauba 9:8, Ali-Imran 3:140 (such as those falsely accusing MM Lee Kuan Yew for being a “follower of Satan” and wanting him to die and “go to hell,” when it can also be easily argued that MM Lee Kuan Yew is perhaps ALLAH’s greatest gift to Singapore! (But LKY has his share of mistakes and imperfections, of course).
“There’s no compulsion in religion. Truth now stands distinct from error.” Al-Baqarah 2:256. “Lo! We [ALLAH] did revealed the Tawrat (Torah) wherein is guidance and light…We [ALLAH] bestowed on Jesus the Gospel wherein is guidance and a light…and an admonition to those who ward off evil” Al-Maida 5:44, 46 “If they had observed the Tawrat and the Gospel, and that [good teachings] which was revealed unto them by their Lord, there would surely be blessings from above them and beneath their feet.” Al-Maida 5:66. “ALLAH has also put a heart of mercy and compassion on the followers of Jesus, son of Mary”. Al-Hadid 57:27. “Christians are the nearest in affection to the Muslims.” Al-Maida 5:82.
Muslims must not forget that “ALLAH has taken up Jesus [to Heaven] unto Himself. ALLAH is ever Mighty and Wise” An-Nisaa 4:158. So Muslims who pray to ALLAH to curse non-Muslims like me or MM Lee Kuan Yew will have their imprecations thrown back to them by ALLAH, as their prayers will have to go through Jesus Who is with ALLAH in Heaven.
Sadly, as many islamic cry-babies lack faith in the goodness of their Quran and Islam’s other holy books, they tend to be uncritical and allow the Islamists and extremists to play almost the whole Islamic field and do the thinking for them, with their violent and wrong interpretations of Islam and the Quran. Hence the many terrorists arrested in Singapore are all Muslims without exception (many of whom were well-educated too, like that once high-flying lawyer and law lecturer Abdul Basheer Abdul Kader, who had studied in RI and then NJC before going to NUS Law Faculty). Sadly, attempts of Muslims to hide their Muslim terrorists to help them evade arrests by our authorities are further evidence of the difficulties of many Muslims integrating into a truly Singaporean milieu. Thank ALLAH, many Muslims have, however, integrated admirably too.
Some years ago, Singapore also had one Quran teacher who believed in waging the “soft” demographic jihad for an islamic takever of Singapore. So he acquired 10 wives and fathered 60 over children. Yet he still wanted to rape his own virgin daughters and make them pregnant as his “Quranic rights” to keep the sexual purity of his virgin daughters. Naturally, Justice Tay Yong Kwang had to mete out 32 years of imprisonment for his crappy claim to have such Quranic authority or rights. So when one of his long-suffering daughters blew the cover and got her incestuous father arrested, shocked waves were generated as many Singaporeans were so shocked that even his well-educated wives could so mindlessly agree with him and were complicit in helping him to assert his questionable “Quranic rights” to rape his daughters to protect their sexual purity. So integration suffered a terrible set-back, as it did during 911 as non-Muslims were too shock for words to say anything.
Yet many of our mindless Muslims also wanted their MUIS officials to be removed for being puppets of the PAP Government or dogs of Lee Kuan Yew, evidently wanting to replace them with Islamists who could then take a stronger position to speak up for the Muslims on “Muslim” issues, which Muslims generally felt their MUIS officials had repeatedly betrayed the Ummah for failing to do so; hence the reported Muslims’ ire and disquiet against their own Muslim leaders.
But what I feel is that MUIS officials have been doing an excellent job over the years, and sadly, were not properly appreciated by their own Muslim people for so gallantly leading our generally ignorant Muslim Ummah on the path of the correct version of Islam—towards progress, enlightenment, and both material and spiritual well-being—to become Muslims who can really appreciate the goodness in their Quran and Hadiths, such as what I am promoting them here. Will I again be falsely accused by Islamists of trying to promote “satanic verses” here?
So it is my belief that MM Lee will be more than happy if Muslims can be very religiously observant and strict on such Islamic virtues distilled from the goodness in their Quran which I have highlighted and promoted here; and go easy on the unhelpful and violent parts of Quranic teachings (such as in Ali-Imran 3:118-120 & At-Tauba 9:5, etc), which are only good for stoking perennial hatred and suspicion of Muslims towards non-Muslims, and good only for promoting the normative islamic dysfunctionality and backwardness, when I have so cogently proved otherwise on what the goodness in their Quran can do to and for them.
What MM Lee was trying to say is that many of our Muslims were/are often very unnecessarily strict in their islamic practices in the wrong way, and often majoring on the minors without the right rationale to make themselves look so ridiculous, such as on halal foods and tudong, etc, on the one hand. On the other, despising the transcendent beauty and virtues that can be found in their Quran. As a result, they often cause their own backwardness and problems, and then resorting to blame the non-Muslims for ‘causing’ their problems, and on their MUIS leaders for their sad state of affairs.
If they have/had got it right on when to be very strict with their islamic practices, then they wouldn’t need to falsely and maliciously accuse me for trying to promote “satanic verses” when it was the goodness in their Quran which many of you already knew I have been passionate in wanting to promote it over the years, even though I am a non-Muslim.
Such incurably upside-down mindset of our Muslims had resisted and will always work against the attempts of our solicitous government at social integration and harmony. That is why islamic terrorism and extremism is here to stay with us forever, unless our Muslims are prepared to allow their leaders in MUIS and Islamic Affairs Minister to open up their closed minds and re-set their wrong thinking away from the backwardness and benightedness of the Middle Eastern. But their refusal to do so is perennially worrying our angst-ridden MM Lee to no end, a grave anxiety that all of us who love Singapore also sadly share.
The next stage is that I had already strongly suggested to our government leaders that it was high time for Singapore to have a Muslim as our next elected President, once President Nathan has completed his tenure of office. And I am suggesting that Mr Abdullah Tarmugi fits the bill to be our next elected President. So can I have the support of our Muslims on this issue to send a clear message of encouragement to PM Lee and MM Lee that Mr Abdullah has widespread support from his own Muslim people too? Their support will be further proof that our Muslims can be further integrated. Or will they sneer at my proposal again and at Speaker Abdullah Tarmugi’s candidacy just because I, a non-Muslim, is his great fan promoting him to be Singapore’s next elected President?
Finally, let the perpetually whining islamic cry-babies not forget that to this day, however hard those very smart and hardworking youngsters from China and India had tried, the record marks of 294 out of 300 for our PSLE is still being held by a Muslim girl who set it in 2007. This goes to show that Muslims also boleh (can excel) against international competition and integrate if only those islamic cry-babies can learn how to trust ALLAH and take a break from their never-ending whining.
Majulah Singapura! May God be with all of us!
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some kind of double standard going on, if these statements came from the opposition or other Singaporeans, they would be arrested.
Dont you think so ? This is worse than the jolly hangman book…
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When all else fails he gets desperate and uses the joker card, it’s called the racial card. Dun fall into the divide and rule ruse
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is this a political move to draw attention to himself for some rhyme or reason , maybe his son cannot function, so this is a political distraction for all ?
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Old already a bit senile, recently someone left also, now everyday must scold people to past time.
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Old fart is creating a very dangerous time bomb this time. I do not know if he does it on intention to break up the unity of the muslim for his political motive, or has he gone so senile to the extend that he don’t even know the seriousness of those highly sensitive statements that can start an all out riot here. Fucking old ah pek if you want to die, go die alone, why drag all with you? The last thing I want to see should there be a breakout of muslim riots in singapore, please muslim brothers know who your target is, not the us native singaporeans. Bloody hell, I may have problems organising my soccer games without my muslim kakis liao!
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Isn’t it a coincidence that the state media, in particular the Shit Times, has been featuring their ‘Dear Leader” everyday for the past month in the hope that they can brainwash the ‘daft’ Singaporeans who spouts so called “hard truths”?
This an orchestration of the ruling party to “prepare the ground” so to speak. The bunch of writers commissioned to publish the Gospel of LKY are doing their job as stated in their charter.
Now here’s the HARD TRUTH for them and the Papies – all the moves you make are going to blow up in your face. Singaporeans are not going to swallow everything you say, as in the past. All the gerrymandering, the bribes, the taunts, the restrictions, the bullying of opposition members, will backfire on you chappies. The more you attempt your stunts, the more it is going to fail.
Going forward, we know you will try more tactics to either bribe, or if that doesn’t work, you will resort to your famous ‘cul de sac’ threats. But these won’t work today. 10 years ago, maybe. Today netizens will open the eyes of their fellow citizens to the REAL TRUTHS of the last 45 years of dictatorship.
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MUIS is the tool of the govt… Rmb its the only religious org under the GOvt.. MUIS.GOV.SG… All those pple there dun have the balls to defend islam or even their own pple.
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so exactly what should singapore muslims do from now onwards?
even some of my muslim friends have packed up and left singapore for good because they think the old man has been “buying” our votes all these elections past.
tell us please since you were one of the pap mp.
perhapps you see more than us and know a lot that we don’t.
we await tour advice.
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http://www.straitstimes.com/BreakingNews/Singapore/Story/STIStory_626758.html
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Inshah allah…….
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If LKY can unite Singaporeans of all ages, race and religion against him, then I consider that one good thing he did for Singapore. What Irony.
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“He urged us Muslims to be less strict?” – He said that in context of integration problem. You can continue, and continue to be a hindrance to integration.
Next, are intermarriages a problem in Islam? – He didn’t say its a problem. Did he? He merely say conversion would be needed.
“Next, are intermarriages a problem in Islam?” – So all muslim who marry each other are incest?
LKY, nobody is asking for your views on Muslim faith. – He did not express his view on Muslim faith. He merely expressed his views on what poses problem to integration in Singapore WHEN BEING INTERVIEWED. So he was ASKED. Dumb brain of yours.
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Dear Mr Yatiman Yusof
Tell the PAP to drop Malaysian Malaysia and sue for re-merger unconditionally !
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And another thing Yatiman Yusof,
Strict adherence to Islam is NOT a hindrance to absorbing technology. Your mind has obviously been brainwashed by the PAP !
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To Oh Tham Eng,
Tell LKY to reject Malaysian Malaysia first. I am NOT anywhere near LKY. LKY’s ideas have NOTHING to do with me. Let him die alone ! I do NOT want to be associated with the PAP and LKY.
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I think this old man is going senile and the loss of his dear wife recently is accelerating this process.
Please do not bother him; let him say what he wants to say; let him rest in peace
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MM Lee is not stupid. All things he does/say is with an agenda. Only he know his true intention. Malay Muslim should not fall into a trap by giving a knee jerk response. Look at the response in the ST Forum he get when he announce of demolishing his house. And now this. He Observing Planning and Taking Action. Best thing is just to Ignore him. He’s catalyst but we have a choice not to react.
Muslim guy
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Can he let his daughter marry a Malay? for integration’s sake?
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Aiyah,he use religion in his political discourse ISD never arrest him hor but if opposition said something like that straight away kena
ISD 2 years at least.Maybe someone from opposition must ask the Police or ISD to charge Old man for breaching his own “law” lor.
Put him away for 5 years enough to let him taste his own medicine mah.How come his PM Son never “control” his “utter rubbish” huh?
What about Yakult and Harimau ?
PAP want to win Chinese votes also no need talk bad about Muslims mah. Wait LKY kena “Fatwa” then know how to shut up man!
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“He urged us Muslims to be less strict?” – He said that in context of integration problem. You can continue, and continue to be a hindrance to integration.
Next, are intermarriages a problem in Islam? – He didn’t say its a problem. Did he? He merely say conversion would be needed.
“All Muslims are brothers or sisters?” – So all muslim who marry each other are incest?
LKY, nobody is asking for your views on Muslim faith. – He did not express his view on Muslim faith. He merely expressed his views on what poses problem to integration in Singapore WHEN BEING INTERVIEWED. So he was ASKED. Dumb brain of yours.
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李光耀”李”(理)不完的惡罪早晚隨著他進入棺材. PAP政權也會因此宣告結束!
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See the political and financial turmoil around, Thailand, USA, Britain, France, Greece, Poland, Ivory Coast, N Korea, Iraq, Pakistan,
We are doing well. Whether we like him or not, the world recognises LKY as a statesman among the highest calibre. He should not have said several things but I prefer to be grateful for the great things he did for Singapore. We shall not curse our leader/s.
I wish all Singaporeans well.
Shalom and salam, one and all.
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Yatiman Yusof:
January 27, 2011 at 9:39 pm Yatiman Yusof(Quote):
“Just look at Malaysia. Ever since our nations separated, Singapore have always been one up against Malaysia in every spheres”.
At your old age you are still an obedient running $#@ of your master Lee. No wonder you have been rewarded to still serve as a messenger boy in some obscure African countries.
Why bring Malaysia into the picture? The one that is up is my finger to you! The issue here is as someone who are still inside the system pls enlightened us muslim on how to be less strict? No need to corner baring. List out the things that LKY wants muslims to adhere to. Then we can have a conversation. Don’t side-tracked the issue.
You are an elder malay muslims and so am I. We are too old to bull shit each other. Tak payah basah basi,list down all that Kuan Yew wants the muslim to kowtow him.
For reference’s sake pls go to TOC and read the article from a malay muslim young man Alfian Sa’at .He sums up LKY pretty well. So stop the bull shit for now. You are well rewarded and you are not in the position to disobey or discredit the hands that feed you. I can empathize you on this one.
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To the author of the letter, yes, you are right. Old man should spend more time worry about himself than the Muslim Singaporeans… nice letter!
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This again is a misnomer. It is not 1 man. It’s a team of men. 14 of them – the old guards of Singapore. People keep perpetuate the myth that Singapore is where it is today because of old fart. That’s wrong. In fact, with the old team gone and essentially with his family running the country, they are making more mistakes than ever…
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Sing in accordance with the song – We are Singapore
This is the time when singapore is facing lots of shit, yes we did
This is the time when troubles seems too much for us to take, and indeed
We are not a nation , says SM Lee,
We are just a tool, to make the gahmen rich
This is our country, and not their land,
But we see no future,
only their lies,
We ruled by famiLEE.
we lost our land,
We are Singapore, We sibeh Kor Lian (pitiful)
Singapore our homeland, and its here we should belong,
Foreigners united take over all our jobs,
We have come so far together, now we lose our pride and dignity,
Singapore no longer nation, just a place to make money
But this is our country, this is our land,
This is our future, this is our life,
Lets save our families, fight for our frens,
Lets Vote out PAP, Singaporeans
We the citizens of Singapore.
Pledge ourselves as one united citizen
REGARDLESS OF RACE LANGUAGE OR RELIGION,
TO BUILD A DEMOCRATIC SOCIETY (not belonging to PAP)
BASED ON JUSTICE AND EQUALITY (not possible according to Lee)
SO as to acieve happiness prosperity and progress for our CHILDREN
we are Singapore, we are Singapore
We will tolerate the PAP no more
We are Singapore, We are Singapore
We will make sure the PAP will surely FALL
THIS IS OUR COUNTRY, THIS IS OUR LAND
THIS IS OUR FUTURE, THIS IS OUR LIVE,
LETS SAVE OUR FAMILES, FIGHT FOR OUR FRENS
Lets Vote out PAP, ,Singaporeans
LETS VOTE OUT PAP, ALL SINGAPOREANS!!!!!!!!!!!!
majulah Singapore!
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IT CAN EASILY BE ARGUED THAT MM LEE KUAN YEW IS ALLAH’S GREATEST GIFT TO SINGAPORE
If we put MM Lee on a comparative, not an absolute scale. Of course he has his share of mistakes. But his pluses overwhelm his minuses. Among his (and our) perennial worries are islamists such as we see proliferating in webforums like TR, enjoying their great party time slandering LKY as an old devil, a follower of Satan and an enemy of Islam; and calling MUIS officials PAP puppets and LKY’s dogs. And yet they have the shamelessnes to proclaim themselves “Muslims”. The truth is, I know more about the goodness of Islam than those islamic bigots. Obviously, they know very little about the great religion of Islam, except for what they mistakenly think they should learn about the strict observances of it that defy both good logic and common-sensibility.
Let it not be forgotten that ALLAH had taken up Jesus to be with Him in Heaven. (An-Nisaa 4:158). So any curses “Muslims” made against MM Lee and officials in MUIS will be heard by the disapproving Jesus in Heaven, and He will not approve them for ALLAH. So such curses will be thrown back to the cursers to suffer their self-condemnation instead.
The truth is, we non-Muslims do not need the help of such slandering and senseless bigots who insist in calling themselves Muslims, who are so good for their islamic skills slandering others with lies, half-truths and wilful distortions, to help non-Muslims view Islam in such very bad light. This is essentially what our wise MM Lee is trying to say that Muslims need not be too strict with their islamic observances, or they end up becoming fanatics and making themselves to be followers of that senseless allah, not the ALLAH Whom I also worship as the all-intelligent Creator of our infinite Universe and everything in it. But MM Lee will want all Muslims to be very, very strict in the observance of such transcendent Islamic goodness as found in Fusilat 41:34, the Prayer of Prophet Suleiman, etc.
Okay, let’s come to a specific instance of what MM Lee meant by the unnecessary strictness in the observance of Islam. Take wearing the tudong, for example. They claim islam mandates their women to wear it to cover up their hairs, etc, to prevent men looking at them with unholy eyes. And yet I had seen young Muslim women wearing form-fitting hijabs, which showed their killer curves, running around in a sports stadium exercising. Worst is the wearing of the burqas or niqabs, such as those worn by the ten mindless though well-educated wives of that lecherous Quran teacher who was sentenced by Justice Tay Yong Kwang to 32 years in jail for raping a number of their virgin daughters in his upside-down way to preserve the virginal purity of his pretty teenage daughters.
Well, if Muslim females wear the tudong as a meritorious symbol (such as to glorify God’s Name)—to signal to others that they are good, reliable, intelligent, well-educated, purposeful, helpful, God-fearing and sensible human beings—like what I see in women like the very accomplished, kind, energetic and intelligent Mdm Halimah Yacob with her tudong, I felt good. So she is a good mascot for the tudong, like what Catholic nuns do for Catholicism, with their habits. These women do not wear such cover-ups to insult men as uncontrollable wild beasts who will get all steam up sexually if they see women’s hairs, etc, uncovered. In other words, if girls do not behave well, they could have the privilege of wearing the tudong removed, as wearing it would not be imposed as a mandate, but as a privilege and an honour for the Muslimahs, something like an incentive and a symbol for excellence; not a negative sex symbol to insult men as silly wild beasts who could never control themselves when they see the uncovered hairs of women, and would want to rape them if they have the opportunity.
Such strict and therefore mindless observance of islam is being very insensitive and downright silly, and so is very bad for our social integration. This is just one example of what the wise MM Lee is trying to point out—-for the good name of ALLAH and Islam; and not to make ALLAH appears like he is allah. And the Muslims ended up becoming benighted and in terrible bondage to such mindlessly strict observance of islamic practices that defy good logic.
So “Inspire me, Lord, to be thankful to Thee for Thy favors to me and my loved ones to do good deeds which will please Thee. Admit me, through Thy mercy, to be among Thy righteous.” An-Naml 27:19. “For the noblest in God’s sight is he/she who is the most righteous.” Al-Hujurat 49:13.
Allahu Akbar! God is Greatest!!
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LKY is still planning a response from the people with all the nonsense he said. He wants to see how much we Singaporeans can take his nonsense. How much patience and tolerance left in us to stomach his bullshit? To see if we will openly defy him thru forums or protes. He is seeking a response to plan his final strategy to keep his SON in power for another 5 years. If PAP won, i can tell you we all are FCUKED.
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Will the creator of PAP
watch his son destroy the PAP ?
Soon we will know
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@Dr Syed Alwi
In your zest of casting aspersions on Mufti and Malay political leadership, you have also decided to include Malay NGOs as being all PAP-controlled in the same breath. This is absurd and untrue. We can all have our grouses and grievances of MUIS being closely aligned with the government, the Mufti being a political appointee, and our disappointment with the Malay political leaders not developing some backbone, and staying silent when callous remarks are made about the Malay/Muslim community. But you have to separate political organisations from non-political ones. Just because Malay NGOs do not voice their disapproval on the comments made by MM Lee does not mean they are PAP-controlled. Most are apolitical NGOs which perform a niche role in the youth, women, elderly or family sectors. By making such an obdurate comment, you have denigrated the hard work done by the Malay NGOs over the years, and continue to do so. Having a doctorate (assuming you are not a medical doctor), you should know better than making such sweeping statements. Else, your doctorate should be questioned, and your viewpoints should be perceived as lacking credibility.
Muslim Patriot
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And thats the real reason why Singapore will become a terrorist hub. Will ISD capture the true creator of terrorism??
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May I ask how did you arrive at this conclusion that “strict observance of Islam is one of the major cause of Muslim’ regressive state”? I’m interested to hear your arguments on this issue.
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Kojakbt and No hope are two guys who make very sensible and well-thought comments. I always make a point to read both their comments. I will strongly recommend others to do. May God bless them.
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The real truth is here in TR. You can literally feel the beat of the ground
As for the constant featuring of writings of MM’s book on ST almost everyday, this is Han Fook Kwang, the chief editor of ST trying to do some sucking up lah… the book is his baby. He led a team of 7 ST journalists to write the book… but I think it’s causing some backfiring…
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So is ISD going to arrest LKY for inciting racial disharmony?
Or is the law not applicable here?
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Look at the way this guy sucks up to MM… makes me sick…
Han Fook Kwang, editor of The Straits Times, said: ‘One thing about MM is that he’s a very consistent person. His views are also very consistent…this doesn’t mean his thinking hasn’t changed. He does take in new developments.’
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Don’t worry, Muslim Will Rule The World By 2030
What do you want to sell to them???
You had to learn to know them, accept them, who the hate Isreal
And what they like “how to market your product to their needs”
Govt. around the world will changed their tune
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It doesn’t matter if he was asked or not. He DID express a view asking Muslim Singaporeans to be less strict in their adherence to their faith. That’s the point.
Personally, I’ve worked with colleagues who are devout Muslims. I don’t have a problem integrating with them. In fact, we all speak Singlish to one another. The BIGGER problem is FT integrating with Singaporeans!
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the old man is up to something no good
everything for him is calculated
hence watch for it
something is coming
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I agree with you. I’m in the IT industry. I’ve worked with Muslim colleagues who are very devout in their Muslim faith. I remembered there was this colleague who really adheres to his faith and prays 5 times a day. He is an excellent programmer. I don’t see how his devotion to his Muslim religion has made him regressive in his programming work…
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from the speed things are gathering
i predict elections would be in march 2011
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no praises for LKY here can survive the harsh
rebuke of fellow TR members
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What an idiotic comment…Didn’t make any sense to me at all, although you did sound like you’re way much smarter than MM Lee himself! (By the way, MM stands for Minister Mentor and not Minister of Mentor! Haha…)Idiot.
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To Yatiman Yusoff,
LKY was blaming observant Muslims for the lack of intergration in our sociey. I may not eat pork but I have no problems sharing a table with a friend eating his char siew fun. I may not join my non Muslims friends when they have their beer but I look forward to joking, gossiping or working with them. I may not marry a non Muslim but that does not in any way affect my relationship with non Muslims at work or play. I am still me, with or without that piece of cloth covering my head. However if others choose to see me differently because of that, is it me or them that is the barrier to intergration ?
In this case, LKY was not talking abt Malays being far behind the other societies. Even if he was, you of all people should know that those Malays who cause social problems with their dysfunctional families , unwed mothers and drug addition would not be that way had they been brought up as strict Muslims as Islam forbids all those.
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@Oh Tham Heng-what has the case of the’Quran Teacher’ got to do with Intergration?How has intergration suffered because of one deviant?It seems that you are judging the whole Muslim community in Singapore on the actions of one man.So do you need us to apologise for him? If so then i would need you to apologise for the trespasses of Rev Jim Baker,the catholic church’s cover up of the sexual abuses of children and the Mormon(that abt covers it).It’s a zero sum game you are pursuing and it will never end-unless of course you are a PAP stooge and your mission is to confuse.Guess what?We are not as gullible as you.
I commend you on your ability to quote from the Quran with such ease. However reading it from cover to cover and attending a course in Comaparative religion studies does not make you understand it’s true meaning.Go to to a proper Ustaz and open up your heart to understand it.
Contrary to appealing for intergration you are just adding to the ‘hot bovine leavenings’(to put it politely)Leave your comparative studies aside for a while and think abt your future for once.If you are truly a god-fearing man then you may like to get down on your knees and pray that the opoosition parties get a chance to save Singapore from the senile old man.If you are a PAP stooge-then you may likewise want o get down on your knees and pray-that we,the people of Singapore, do not find you nad your like.
VOTE THEM OUT
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“What MM Lee was trying to say is that…” Oh Tham Eng
Tham Eng you should let MM Lee explain what he means.
LKY is a wily politician and clever-talking lawyer. He can convince you that a black stone is white and, a black stone is white.
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im amazed. im a muslim..yes i gt multi racial circle of friends. stop all this arguments. it will bring us nowhere… if we are a real strong believer of islam… no matter how ppl try to manipulate our mind.. we will not fall apart same goes to other religions. let by gone be by gone. we move on.. show them doesnt mean we are muslims we are ‘useless’ to the country. we cnt blame lky 100%. why?? look at our malay muslim community… some of them work as a hostess…consume alcohol..killing a innocent child..gangsterism..etc.. they’re muslims too… but they give a bad impression to others such as non muslims. like i say.. we move on.. enough of war going on arnd the world.. we have to work together hand in hand.. every human being deserved to be forgiven. amin.
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It is pure ‘DUPLICITY’ for LKY to deliberately create such a controversy – simply to gauge from Singaporean reaction that will give him an insight to the depth of support given to the Malays by the other ethnic communities in Singapore.
He stuck his neck out, and got the slippers thrown at him by all Singaporeans – whether Malay or not, whether a Muslim or otherwise.
All Singaporeans will form common solidarity to spite LKY’s attempt to interfere into the religious domain – when he had been an aetheist throughout his life, and have probably – only recently become agnostic[1] – even as he dabbled in Buddhism for a while.
LKY has always been an arrogant person – can anyone expect him to believe that GOD exist ?
With LKY always holding to the belief that an intelligent being will proceate another intelligent being – one should then ask if his parents are of any superior stock that produced him into this world ?
If both of his parents are simple ordinary folks – when his father was no more then a bill collector at Shell Petroleum, and later became a counter salesman at B.P. de Silva, and his mother is an ordinary housewife – one will need to question LKY as to – how his “superior being” come into existence ?
He is probably created from a super genetic amoeba that had indulged in asexual reproduction. [2]
With an origin from the lowest life form as an amoeba, it is not a surprise that he will project such aggressive and arrogant superiority complex – when it had emanated from the deepest darkest hole of inferiority.
.
.
[1] Aetheist vs Agnostic
http://www.buzzle.com/articles/atheist-vs-agnostic.html
http://atheism.about.com/od/aboutagnosticism/a/atheism.htm
[2] ‘How do amoeba carryout asexual reproduction ?’
http://askville.amazon.com/amoeba-carryout-asexual-reproduction/AnswerViewer.do?requestId=35418064
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MUIS new name; MAJLIS UGAMA PAP SINGAPURA
MUIS new Mufti; LEE KUAN YEW.
MUIS guidance book; “LKY’s HARD TRUTHS TO KEEP S”PORE GOING”
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I think he also wants to treat his home like Berlin wall……knock them down, and each brick can sell for $10,000……and only CBKia will Q and buy…..
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Yatiman Yusof:
January 27, 2011 at 9:39 pm (Quote)
I am a former PAP MP. I urge Muslims in Singapore to heed Mr. Lee Kuan Yew’s advise. Don’t become emotional. While we respect our religion we must also get real in life. Muslims nations are lacking behind non Muslims nations. Why go far? Just look at Malaysia. Ever since our nations separated, Singapore have always been one up against Malaysia in every spheres. In Singapore the Muslim have alot of catching up to do with the other races in all fields. Economically Musilms in Singapore are lagging behind the other races. See Mr. Lee’s statement in the right perspective. He is telling you to progress and he knows that our strict observance of Islam is one of the major cause of Muslim’ regressive state.
Yatiman.. mak lu punya laki..
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All of you are going to jail for this. Any last words.?
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To im anonymous
LKY is asking us Muslims to be less strict in our observance to our religion. You brought up cases of Malays who are hostesses, who consume alcohol and get involved in gangsterism. Islam forbids all those. So, shouldn’t they in fact, contrary to what LKY advocates, be more strict Muslims ?
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Hope we have a Malay leader or lawyer standing up and make a police report on what old man had said…….
What he said is against the Harmony act…….
It will be interesting to see how the SPF react……..
Abdul Malek used the word “burn” and SPF is so fast in their job….
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What happen to our Religion Studies in Secondary school? Last time I heard, Bible knowledge for the Christian…..and those without a religion can choose Confucianism…..even got O level exam some more…..
I don’t heard any thing about this now…..MOE screw up again?
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hey kawan, dont bother with this fcuk turd old fart lee. use some common sense – even if we dont like dogs, we cant stop them barking. just steer clear from them.
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Great stuff, my Singaporean brother.
I am not Muslim, but I can understand your anger and I believe your reaction is justified. No one should tell another how to practice their religion.
I believe your article reflects the true public sentiment on the issue. Hoowah!!!
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dear muslim brother,
you seems to have alot of angst. relax. you know what to do with your votes. thats all. chill yeah?
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I think we all fall for the old man’s political tactics before election.
This is called political distraction i.e. trying to deflect the real issues of the country to other long standing controversial issues.
Moreover, when one kept on talking about the political figure, he is always bein fixated on the minds of the voters and they may even vote for him due to the constant reference.
You can see the daily reference to him for the past few weeks, since his book is being published, perhaps right up till polling day.
Dont be fooled Singaporeans!
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MUFTI AKA WAYANG KULIT PUPPET, COMMENTS PLEASE!!! MUIS, DONT LET FEAR CHOKE YOU, IF YOU REPRESENT MUSLIMS AND ISLAM, SPEAK OUT.
REMEMBER THE QURANIC VERSE, “TOLD WHO SELL THEIR SOULS FOR A LITTLE PROFIT…..”, NEED I CONTINUE?
LKY, WHY DONT YOU PREACH MODERATION TO CHINESE AND TELL THEM NOT TO BURN PAPER DURING THE HUNGRY GHOST MONTH? STATISTICS SHOW AN INCREASE IN REPORTED ASTHMA ATTACKS AND RESPIRATORY PROBLEMS IN SINGAPORE DURING THIS TIME?
LKY, YOU ARE A SHIT STIRRER, JUST STIRRING UP SHIT TO USE THE MUSLIMS AS A SCAPEGOAT FOR THE UPCOMING ELECTION!!! YOU WANT PEOPLE TO THINK THAT WITHOUT PAP, MUSLIMS WILL BE OUT OF CONTROL!!!
GET A LIFE, SENILE OLD MAN!!!
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KY trying to divert the attention away from his son, something is cooking stay tuned!
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Gilbert, a very good observation of yours regarding the use of Political Distraction to distract from the Real Issues at the hearts of the people.
TReditors/MODS: Might be a good idea to do a write out regarding this issue (of Political Distraction, with examples of how some of these are falsely made important or used as mind/perception blockers) , to open up and enlighten the minds of the Singapore voters , for them to see through the shadow play.
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Don’t dismiss his article just like that. I’m sure any devoted Muslim will be pissed off by the old man’s remarks. This isn’t the first time he has offered an ignorant and insulting opinion on a subject he knows next to nothing about. Remember the other time when he said you had to choose between roads and canals to prevent floods? PUB proved him wrong.
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Sensible post by Gilbert Goh
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the way i would put it:
ponder
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King Crippler of Temasek:
January 28, 2011 at 2:40 am
King Crippler of Temasek(Quote):
“Yatiman.. mak lu punya laki..”
Friend you are way too civil…it should be #@*&%%!! &&%$?”"@! *&$?!?….##++@#?”!
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The OP’s thinking is pathetic. MM did not speak about muslims in a derogatory way. What
he mentioned is a fact that muslims integrate the least with other cultures. They kinda
keep themselves aloof, and is primarily due to the strictness of their religion. MM does
not have a personal agenda against muslims, else given his control, he could have wiped
them out. But no, he believes in racial harmony and simply knows that muslims are the
hardest to integrate.
In contrast, our OP, a devoted muslim, just showers him with expletives and hatred. If
he is a good example of a singaporean muslim, then its pathetic. But I hope not. He is
making it personal, and on top, he is bitter.
Most of u are so bitter against the PAP, that even their sensible remarks lead to criticism
and nonsense.
How many of u non-muslims will go and marry a muslim, and vice versa. What MM said about
closeness n relactance to integrate is true.At least, unlike many countries he does not
play divisive n riot politics which u see in many countries where either Muslims are in
majority or minority.
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monkeysee:
January 27, 2011 at 7:16 pm (Quote)
Seems to me that much of the criticism is blindly directed at the old man, and not the content of what he said.
I personally do not disagree with his comment that Islam is far more isolationist in its requirements of its believers than other religions, and this can be, and is, a barrier to integration with other members of society who are from other religions.
For example, marriage between a Muslim and a Buddhist cannot be achieved without one of them relinquishing their religion. Muslims are not allowed to give up their religion. So it would be either the non-Muslim converting to Islam, or the Muslim forgoing family and community ties as a consequence of relinquishing the faith. Either way, true integration does not take place.
Eating at the same communal table would be impossible for strict adherence of haram /halal standards without the non-muslim members agreeing to eat Halal. The reverse (i.e. Muslims agreeing to eat Haram food) is simply not possible. Again, integration is impeded.
Yes, there are parallels in other religions in food, marriage, etc., but none of them are quite as strict as Islam is with regards to consequence for disobedience. And one could even argue many people of these other religions are not as stringent in following their religious precepts either.
Perhaps if Muslims rebut the Old Man with facts and examples as to why he is wrong, rather than just baying for his damnation, the conversation would be more fruitful, and convincing.
———————-
Totally agrees with you!
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Oh Tham Eng:
January 27, 2011 at 9:52 pm (Quote)
WHAT IS REALLY BUGGING OUR ANGST-RIDDEN MM LEE KUAN YEW?
What MM Lee was trying to say is that many of our Muslims were/are often very unnecessarily strict in their islamic practices in the wrong way, and often majoring on the minors without the right rationale to make themselves look so ridiculous, such as on halal foods and tudong, etc, on the one hand. On the other, despising the transcendent beauty and virtues that can be found in their Quran. As a result, they often cause their own backwardness and problems, and then resorting to blame the non-Muslims for ‘causing’ their problems, and on their MUIS leaders for their sad state of affairs.
If they have/had got it right on when to be very strict with their islamic practices, then they wouldn’t need to falsely and maliciously accuse me for trying to promote “satanic verses” when it was the goodness in their Quran which many of you already knew I have been passionate in wanting to promote it over the years, even though I am a non-Muslim.
Such incurably upside-down mindset of our Muslims works against the attempts of our solicitous government at social integration and harmony. That is why islamic terrorism and extremism is here to stay with us forever, unless our Muslims are prepared to allow their leaders in MUIS and Islamic Affairs Minister to open up their closed minds and re-set their wrong thinking away from the backwardness and benightedness of the Middle Eastern. But their refusal to do so is perennially worrying our angst-ridden MM Lee to no end, a grave anxiety that all of us who love Singapore also sadly share.
—————–
Totally agrees!
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what is happening to the Malay community
i dont see anything wrong with my Malay colleagues or neighbours
as far as i am concern they
are more human and real than LKY and ministers
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A Muslim writer here swearing and cursing our founding father to death due to differences in opinion. It says a lot about your upbringing and faith. Judge yourself before you judge LKY. I’m sure your Allah would not endorse it. Please keep your religion belief to yourself. Don’t expect people to take your religion as the gospel truth.
Stupid of TR to put up the middle finger picture. This will piss a lot of people off. It also potray badly on the opposition.
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I agree with you absolutely, Gilbert Goh.
IMO, your comment, out of all the posts in this thread, is the ONLY one which managed to see through LKY’s statement to his real motives.
Not even some apparently learned and highly educated readers in here could stop themselves from jumping into the fray and throwing fuel onto the blazing fire kindled by the writer of the article. Proof that LKY still has that much mind power over all of us.
@picknose: January 28, 2011 at 12:37am smelt something fishy. He said everything for LKY is calculated. You are correct, brother, and we should all watch LKY in the same way.
LKY has got all you squabbling guys in here just where he wants you – fighting each other, arguing with each other, building up hostilities between each other and spewing venom against each other. You are behaving exactly like the daft puppets he thinks you are. You are dancing away to his twisted tune.
Wake up! Is this what we are? Daft drugged-out zombies willing to do his bidding at a snap of his fingers or a word from his lips? Ready to fall into his easy trap of political distraction?
Where is our sense of Singaporean identity? Where is our Singaporean perspective? Have we so easily forgotten how we played and studied and grew up together, lived and worked side by side in harmony all our lives?
Come on, guys, he was NOT just giving his opinion, his ‘rare insights’. No. Everything he says and does has an ulterior motive. For himself. We must never forget that.
Note that these interviews were conducted from December 2008 to October 2009. They were compiled into a book and published only this month, less than an estimated 3 months or so before the election, if assuming it will be in 2nd quarter or before then. Someone mentioned March 2011. It might even be late February. There’s nothing to stop them bringing it forward, judging from the electioneering and fear-mongering being jacked-up into overdrive now.
Excerpts from his book or reports on it are being published EVERY DAY. Gilbert Goh says it best: Moreover, when one kept on talking about the political figure, he is always bein fixated on the minds of the voters and they may even vote for him due to the constant reference.
LKY knows this mental trick will sway the fence-sitters and swing voters in his favour. Are you one of these zombies? Or will the daily fix of his drugs ‘fix’ you and turn you into one?
If we know LKY, he will not allow a racist or religiously sensitive quote of his to be highlighted in the MSM without a very good reason.
What he is doing, expertly and consummately, is:
(a) creating animosity between Malays and the other races, so as to make the other races, the Chinese especially, feel safer in voting for PAP.
(b) reassuring the new citizens, particularly the PRC new citizens, that the PAP govt will ‘fix’ any fears or problems they may have in integrating into a multi-racial society, so as to get these new citizens to vote for PAP.
The question of why he doesn’t instead play the Chinese off against the other races or reassure the other races, is simple to answer. The minority races are too small in numbers to bother about. It is the largest group which will enable the PAP to win elections.
And there are ready-made racial and religious divisions in society which he knows can use without having to reveal his true motives.
Yes. Do not be fooled, my fellow Singaporeans.
MY VOTE IS FOR OPPO. PLEASE CONTEST IN MY CONSTITUENCY (Marine Parade).
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Very well written… enjoy reading it. like the style the author write…
BTW I read some comments saying that Singapore have develop faster and better than our neighbour and I feel there is no link to religion here…
I came across some information on the internet about eugenics and how it was part of the plan in the NWO for population reduction… and think about it… Singapore used to practice family planning “stop at 2″ campaign.. and it is said that those countries that practice will benefit… economically… And I remember there was one year during a speech by PM LHL IF I don’t remember wrongly I heard him mentioning the word New World Order…
I might be wrong and thinking too much… its just my view.
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“this is called political distraction i.e. trying to deflect the real issues of the country to other long standing controversial issues.”
This might work in the “ancient” past where the traditional one-sided media was able to paint whatever they wished to paint. As we know now, this is the internet age – where spin & propaganda have become common knowledge and where chinks in any armor are now revealed & exposed for people to take a more balanced view (not one-sided).
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We’ve got to acknowledge the fact that without lky, sg won’t be as developed and recognized on a global platform like what we are today. Sg will be in great trouble when he’s gone, you’ve got to admit it. Stop over-reacting. You all are being lame and please, for goodness sake, think twice before you post anything that can land you in jail.
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Islam is intergrated in many races.
In Singapore, Malays made up majority of Muslims. Indian Muslims are next, followed by our Bangladeshi’s workers and then there are quite a number or Chinese and Caucasians Muslims.
There are 21 million Muslims in China.
There are 160 million Muslims in India.
There are 3.9 millions Muslims in Thailand.
There are 4.6 million Muslims in Philippines.
In Singapore, there are 700 thousands Muslims.
Yes, Muslims have Halal food.
Jews have Kosher food. Do note they are more strict than Muslims in terms of food.
Hindus dont eat beef and some are vegetarians.
Buddhists are vegetarians as well.
MM Lee wants Muslims to be more flexible in eating non Halal food?
When you buy most kind of food in Supermarket or shops, look at the labels.
There are Halal signs from all over the world. Besides the norm of Malaysia and Indonesia, nowadays, i see a lot from China, Phillipines, Australia, Vietnam, Thailand and more.
Plus , all those from US have kosher signs. (U), (UD), (K) and such.
So is it really a problem about integration?
Or does the problem lies somewhere else?
To the Author, I understand your anger. I am angry and dissapointed myself. But let’s all take a deep breath. Lets not make this anger cause our unhappiness.
Insyallah, all will be fine.
Salam.
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that is a chinese hand lol
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Hello Author of the letter,
Your god allah give u a brain for a reason, that is to use it.
Not come here to talk nonsense.
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Dr Syed Alwi,
Long have i said, from the Friday sermons in Mosque given out by MUIS have and has been controlled by none other then LKY idiot himself. Also, long have i said that can you guess who is the Mufti of this tiny nation? Its the old fart himself LKY. Syed Isa Semait are his puppet. Lavish him with richness. A driver to drive him in a big car. The list may go on… LKY has been holding to his vengeance against malay/muslim since before independence. For that reason, he is changing the history of Singapore ever so often making the young confuse.
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@ Ben Kunhi:
January 27, 2011 at 11:13 pm Ben Kunhi(Quote)
//Can he let his daughter marry a Malay? for integration’s sake?//
I bet he don’t mind but who wants to marry her? The only woman uglier than his daughter is his daughter-in-law Ho Ching!
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Fwah, cancer and albino grandson! Really hitting below the belt!! Hahaha!! Yet somehow, I think its a fair blow since the old chap doesn’t fight fair either
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This is a reply to MUSLIM PATRIOT,
Friend – you do NOT even have the guts to put your name down – so just exactly how credible are you ?
Please lah – this is Singapore ! If what you say is true – then please publish a letter from your NGO here in TR ot TOC lah !
Don’t talk so much when you got no guts !
Regards
Dr Syed Alwi
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agreed.
let’s go for a teh tarek break at changi village or jalan bussuroh at our muslim indian’s friend store.
heard their nasi lemak and traingled curry puffs are piping hot and made by a s79 years old maly lady trying to supplement her children’s income which is barely enough to survive for their children and grand children.
you know lah, everything price up but salary still down.
let’s have a break and talk about the good old days of growing up together as one people, one nation, regardless of race, language or religion.
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good one.
agreed.
god knows, the pap may do it you know.
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I was reading this article on MRT on my phone and shared it with a stranger , a philipino. I think he enjoyed it.
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Oi Corporal Ridzuan!
Polish my shoes, then later remember to escort MM to go for his pedicure appointment at 4pm.
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if the price is right, he may say he owns the black stone and sell it to you.
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The way you started I thought you were talking about that Oh Tham Eng guy!
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Yes lah: F U !!!
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how true!!
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Fuck you LKY!
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I won’t let writers like you to represent us, the Muslim community, you are more of a disgrace now to the religion and the community. If you want to retaliate, educate the Muslims on the challenges they are facing now and not… duh I am even wasting my time typing this…
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Before you all start any remarks, THINK. Without Mr Lee, we will not be independent. Singapore will not be separated from Malaysia.
You, who served NS, should know more of the enemy’s stories. Don’t tell me you were not paying attention when you were told how neighbouring countries try to put ple into our country. Did you do your best as part of NS men? Or all the time you are just grumbling you shouldn’t be doing this and that but enjoying life?
Every Singaporean Man goes through NS. Even Mr Lee’s grandson! The king will still be punished if he’s doing the wrong thing. If you don’t even know this, please go back to school.
There are goods and bads that come out of Mr Lee. Whether to impose them or not, you need more ministers etc to go through. You think ple are so brainless to follow whatever Mr Lee says? It all depends on oneself. Mr Lee only urges but you are putting words in his mouth.
Don’t psycho ple to do what they should. You can vote for any party for who he cares. Do you know any politics? Can you take his stress for Singapore? How do you make Singapore survive when we don’t even have any raw materials? How can you make unemployment rate as low as possible? How to make Singapore a safe place to live in? Why did Mr Lee’s son got cancer? You don’t even know anything! You are just being immature!
Again, before you speak out your mind, THINK. Without him thinking out for us Singaporeans, would you be able to stand where you are now? Are your fore fathers able to be where they are now?
If you guys are just so unpleasant with whoever is ruling now or in future, just leave Singapore la. We ple here don’t need Singaporeans like you. Are you able to defend for Singapore if we are being attack? Do you even know how to prevent it? Probably you are the first to escape. I will continue to defend for my country, for my people because I’m proud to be a Singaporean under Mr Lee’s guidance.
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54
good speech. (Y) hope you go to jail for this.
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Ever read to Koran? these are words from a man and not a God… No God holds grudges like the Koran ask..No Religion has to kill in order to exist….
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Lee Kwan Yew is instigating the Muslim again and tries to incite racial and religious hatred to gain vote from the non Muslim majority.
He is playing with fire again.
The people of all races and religions better get united to vote PAP out.
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[...] A muslim Singaporean to LKY (Take this one with a pinch of salt and lots of sambal please, you might want it out of your system as soon as you’re done with it – I have a feeling it won’t stay published online for long) [...]
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Dr. Syed Alwi @
Kindly tell me the difference between Malaysian Malaysia and Najib’s 1(one)Malaysia.
Unity in Diversity is enshrined in the Pancasila of the Indonesian constitution.The difference between Malaysia a Monarchy with Islam as the official religion and Indonesia a secular Republic is Christians are given airtime on TV for their Sunday services and just in case you are not aware,Bataks(malays)Menadonese(malays)Flores Nusantara(malays)are majority Christians.
Their Unity in Diversity is literally GENUINE.Will your call for U in D for our re-merger with Malaysia unconditional but base on your U in D be acceptable to the Malaysians???
Come of it Dr. there are two sides too a coin.
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Gilbert’s comments about political distraction is so true. Think about how this might play out:
[Trigger] > LKY goes on record talking about Muslims and asks them to be “less strict”
[Proable reaction] > Some muslims react strongly (like this article). Might even provoke some to react violently.
[Consequence] > LKY comes back and says to concerned non-Muslims and Muslims alike that only PAP can ensure peace and harmony with their (strong & iron-grip) policies.
[Implication] > Singapore still needs PAP to lead them and he is still the MAN.
[Appropriate action] > Do not respond / ignore LKY’s comments. He is putting a Morton’s Fork dilemma (damned if you do, damned if you don’t).
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I am a Chinese Christian, but I wish I was Muslim – so I can declare fatwa on the big-mouth!
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Delete the attched picture if u wanna talk abt ALLAH, Prophet n Islam…how can u be so ignorant n rude…u r a disgrace to attach such pic…im sorry but u r no diff than others by doin this
Salam
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PAP are illuminati puppets…
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to all my muslims bros and sisters…. u know wat the Quran had written…. don’t let this issue enrage ourselves… as true muslims we must handle this issue as clever as possible just like our Prophet…
salam…
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AMIN IS THE TYPE OF MUSLIMS SINGAPORE MUST HAVE AND MM LEE IS ALLAH’S GOOD MEDICINE MAN
Hi Amin!
I am so very proud of you for your great attitude. Your inspiring post is the best I have read on this topic from an ordinary Muslim. You are indeed a true Muslim, as all thinking persons can see from your post that you are a really kind and sincere man, and you have tremendous goodwill and a warm heart for others.
As for MM Lee, he is undoubtedly ALLAH’s good and trusty medicine man doling out again ALLAH’s bitter but life and health-giving medicine. So I urge all Muslims who need this good medicine to take it since it really is from ALLAH. Otherwise I would not have proclaimed MM Lee as ALLAH’s greatest gift to Singapore. He has not failed Muslims and he will never fail them, as long as ALLAH lives! It is time that those perennially whining Islamic cry-babies grow up and start eating solid meat, and not always sucking their teats and eating dao hui (soybean curd). So what MM Lee said is not to denigrate and/or destroy Muslims or Islam, but to point the way to help and strengthen Muslims and help them to regain their greater dignity as ALLAH’s glorious images that they were created in.
MM Lee also sincerely wants to empower Singapore Muslims with great abilities to honour and glorify ALLAH, if only those forever-fragile Muslims will not react so emotionally and mindlessly—in such “knee-jerk way”. Muslims must learn to always trust ALLAH if they have not already done so.
I repeat: MM Lee meant well, not ill for our Muslims, and it is high time all our sincere and pious Muslims stop taking their pointers on all things Islamic from the backward, benighted and problem-ridden Middle East to create troubles for our society, instead of getting them direct from ALLAH’s teachings themselves. Does not ALLAH give all Muslims a good brain to think too (as He does to the non-Muslims)? And good Muslim leaders in MUIS, your wise Mufti, the inspiring Minister Prof Ya’acob Ibrahim and MPs to guide them? But I am not saying they are perfect and infallible leaders. Criticise them, by all means, if they have been negligent in looking after the affairs and well-being of the Muslims. But it is time to start giving them their well-deserved praises too when they have been most conscientious in looking after us.
By all means, if Muslims need to learn anything from the Middle Eastern Muslims, learn them eclectically to enable them to become problem-solvers, and not add on to the ever-swelling ranks of some of the world’s greatest and vilest trouble-makers and murderers that Islam seems to be the most prolific producers for an already very troubled planet earth, other than being the prodigious producers of Middle Eastern oil.
Amin, you are right to say in your post about Muslims: that “if we are a real strong believer of Islam… no matter how people try to manipulate our mind.. [Muslims] will not fall apart same; goes to other religions. let by gone be by gone. we move on.. show them doesn’t mean we are Muslims we are ‘useless’ to the country. we can’t blame lky 100%…” Yes, Show the non-Muslims and the world!
Very well said, Amin. Bravo! May ALLAH be praised on account of you! Allahu Akbar!!
Let’s face it. We can give another $10 million dollars to PM Lee HL for his salaries, and yet there will still be many things he can’t do for us. Ditto for MM Lee. Because they are not the Almighty themselves. Our dear MM, however, has said he had given all (or almost all?) his millions of dollars of salaries to charity.
Only ALLAH can do everything for us. But we must be prepared to humble ourselves and obey Him, the Holy and Wise One. Then He will give us the inspiration, the strength, the wisdom and abilities to do great and wonderful things for others, for our country and for Him. Then ALLAH will be our Greatest Inspiration to make us a powerful and most effective force for spreading divine goodness and love. And that will be our greatest honour and privilege/favour if we are so chosen as His instruments to spread His Great Glory, Goodness and Love, as the wise Prophet Suleiman (King Solomon in my Bible) so passionately prays for in his transcendent prayer in An-Naml 27:19.
You are right to say we/Muslims can’t blame MM Lee, as I feel I can in fact easily prove that he is ALLAH’s greatest gift to Singapore. That is why no Singapore Muslim in TR to date is able to rebut my bold statement, which of course means that they also believe it to to be true in their hearts, but is too proud to admit it. Yet the perpetually whining islamic cry-babies are still doing what they always love doing: complaining and slandering MM Lee to no end, with their very hurtful lies, half-truths, fabrications, distortions and obfuscations; and even slandering your Muslim leaders in MUIS and your Mufti as LKY’s lap dogs and as PAP’s puppets. Sadly, this seems to be the thing many Singapore Muslims want to prove to non-Muslims that they are so vulnerable and so good in: their islamic gulliblity and islamic skills to fabricate lies, hurl slanders distort facts and truths in their incredibly upside-down way to do social integration for Singapore. Who can be so stupid as to believe in this? But, of course, as I have said, MM Lee had admitted to his fair share of honest mistakes. So what more do those Muslims want him to do, beside wanting to hang him upside down so that they can then see him right-side up?
Some years ago in 2000, there was another “Amin”—full name “Amin b Sumadi”. He was then 13-years-old, and was reported to the police by his MacPherson Secondary School classmates and teacher for printing Singapore money with the new computer set his grandfather bought for him. So the police charged him in a criminal court. Fortunately, my very good friend, then AC Lim Soo Gee, was put in charge of the case by CP Khoo Boon Hui. He returned by call to CID to find out what was up in my mind. I repeated by appeal for understanding and compassion for poor Amin. He was really poor in almost every sense of the word. Father was a sickly man and so he worked erratically. Mum was a hawker’s stall assistant, and they lived in a rented HDB flat in crime-infested MacPherson housing estate.
To cut the long story short, AC Lim accepted my appeal for Amin and had the criminal charge withdrawn when it was half-way in the prosecution stage in an open court. Because AC Lim was also from a dirt poor family before he became a big shot, so he understood what it was like to be living in abject poverty. We were also from Christian families, attending the same church once and living in the same kampong. So he really understood what I was appealing for Amin, and he withdrew their criminal charge against Amin just like that— because he had the authority to do so, and he trusted me.
When AC Lim’s elder brother started working in HDB, he got their family their first HDB flat in MacPerson HDB Estate where Amin lived. As you know, MacPherson Estate is the Singapore’s equivalent of a poor man’s housing estate—often ridden with crimes, murders, etc. So that was why it was so easy for the compassionate AC Lim to decide whether to proceed or not with their criminal prosecution, even though printing Singapore money has always been a very serious criminal offence. And because he knew that I had always been a very helpful person, he trusted my good sense of judgment and compassion and accept my appeal for a Muslim boy. In fact, years earlier, when AC Lim’s family moved house to their brand new HDB flat in MacPherson, I had helped them to move house, helping his elder brother to carry their very heavy things up to their seventh floor (I think). That is why it is always good to be helpful, as this is ALLAH’s will for all of us.
Had it not been for AC Lim taking charge of the criminal case, I didn’t think I could be that amazingly successful helping Amin got away scotch free from a serious crime. Because laws are laws. But if we do have good friends in powerful positions, and if we have a very good cause to plead or appeal on behalf of the needy or the deserving when they are in trouble, powerful connections do come in very useful. Even ALLAH Himself is compassionate and merciful, though He also has given us His moral laws to follow. This is how the world and the Universe of ALLAH always operate for the truly repentant and the pure in heart, so that we can all reflect His Great Glory; help spread His Great Love; and dispense the Succour to those in need, to help them turn over to a new and better life. Then we can all be blessed, and our society will be peaceful, harmonious, progressive and enlightened; in effect, we will become ALLLAH’s most beloved nation on planet earth! May ALLAH be greatly praised!
But it is not only in the Muslim community that we have gangsterism, teenage pregnancies, alcoholism, drug-taking, crimes, etc. Other races are similarly afflicted too. And our society really is in need of many more kind and caring people like you and me who have so much goodwill for others. So you are correct and you have touched many hearts to write that: “we have to work [hard] together hand in hand..[that] every human being deserved to be forgiven.”
We must, therefore, not always depend on PM Lee and other leaders to solve our social problems for us. We are stakeholders too, with our transcendent vision for our beloved Singapore. So we must learn and help ourselves to be part of the solutions, and not be the cause of many more problems with our endless quarrelings over race, religion, halal foods, tudongs, etc. And we all end up doing the devil’s works to destroy and disintegrate our fragile society, instead of integrating it the way our solicitous and angst-ridden MM Lee desires—that we should all be united in doing it before his time to leave this world comes.
So “Inspire us, O Lord, to be thankful to Thee for Thy favours to us and our loved ones to do good deeds which will please Thee. Admit us, through Thy mercy, to be among Thy righteous. “An-Naml 27:19. “For the noblest in God’s sight is he/she who is the most righteous.” Al-Hujurat 49:13. Ameen!
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{im anonymous:
January 28, 2011 at 1:36 am
“im amazed. im a muslim..yes i gt multi racial circle of friends. stop all this arguments. it will bring us nowhere… if we are a real strong believer of islam… no matter how ppl try to manipulate our mind.. we will not fall apart same goes to other religions. let by gone be by gone. we move on.. show them doesnt mean we are muslims we are ‘useless’ to the country. we cnt blame lky 100%. why?? look at our malay muslim community… some of them work as a hostess…consume alcohol..killing a innocent child..gangsterism..etc.. they’re muslims too… but they give a bad impression to others such as non muslims. like i say.. we move on.. enough of war going on arnd the world.. we have to work together hand in hand.. every human being deserved to be forgiven. amin.”}
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I don’t know which school LKY visits but as a Muslim myself, I always have lunch with my non-Muslim friends. And I’m still doing it now.
In fact, I gotta give credits to my non-Muslim friends who always spare a thought for me and go “Hey but there’s no Muslim food at this coffeeshop”. Thank you guys! I know sometimes it’s such an inconvenience to non-Muslims but we appreciate your gesture.
So I strongly suggest all Muslims to not take LKY’s words to heart. C’mon let’s take the high road instead and be classy.
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[Quote: StoopidSinker:]
You are really idiot.
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@Dr Syed Alwi
Amazing logic. Wonder how you got your doctorate. If credibility for you is for people to put their real names, and if they don’t, what they say is not credible, then almost everyone on TR here, and what they say, are not credible. I was referring not to anonymity, but your viewpoints as lacking credibility by making certain sweeping statements unbecoming of one with a doctorate. By the way, Syed Alwi is not some special name that people might be able to identify you when they come across you in person. There is also a Syed Alwi Road in Singapore in case you did not know.
I suggest you look up the meaning of apolitical in the dictionary. Part of why some of the Malay NGOs are effective is because they stay away from the political limelight, and work tirelessly behind the scenes on various issues of concern to the community. Their efforts are often underappreciated, and wrongfully slammed by people like yourself. If indeed you have volunteered your time with any of the longstanding Malay NGOs, you would not hold such views that they are all being PAP-controlled. In fact, you are also the only one in the entire thread that has mentioned Malay NGOs so I see no need for any Malay NGOs to publish any letter. I responded to your comment to illustrate how ill-defined and erroneous your viewpoint is.
Regards,
Muslim Patriot
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As-Salamu Alaykum.
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The former Mufti Isa Semait appears in yesterday’s night Suria channel.I cannot make it out what the interview was about. The interviewer and the mufti for whatever reasons didn’t convince me that he was not a stooge.
Today’s Berita Harian reported some malay organisations and community leaders responded to comments made by MM Lee.They do not agree with the old man,as for MUIS standard reply only. True to malay culture and tradition when one is angry…they hide their pain.
But if you want to gauge the anger, TR is the place. We are really angry and the ballot box will be our battle ground. The mosque congregation are badly hurt. I have a weird feeling that PAP will be punished by Muslims and Hindus in this election. As for the 75% majority chinese just half of your votes will tumble PAP down. Vote out the PAP!
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Who is currently running the country. Looks like only the old man.
Everyday his face is in the news papers with chosen rubbish quotes to stir the public.The biased news papers have nothing to report.
Where are all the Ministers and MP’S. No sound from them.
Now this biased newspaper has started with bull shit from Nathan.
What is really sad is that there is no reports on any of the opposition activities.
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Frankly speaking who give a hoots about a senile old man who talks about Islam which he knows none of it. As a Muslim myself, I feel that no leader of ANY COUNTRY has the right to comment about ANY religion or faiths. We Muslims are a peaceful lot but when comes to Islam we will defend our faith till the end just like any other faiths. So any future leaders PLEASE mind what you say about faith and religion. If you can’t keep your mouth shut for the the good of mankind. Pls kindly make way to any old folks home & register yourself to be permanently be taken care of. What good are a leader are u if you can’t make yr people happy. Only senile old man would open the topic on a touchy subject. Anyway, May God Forgive You For Your Sins………….
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OK people, just my 2 cents:
Firstly I think that we should first ask LKY what did he meant by being ‘less strict’? Cause if he meant by that for Muslims to be less observant on our Mandatory Syariah Law that has been stated by Allah, then sorry we can’t do that. Period.
I mean what is the use of a religion if u don’t follow it closely and obey all the laws?
And I really think that a Muslim ministers or MUIS as an Islamic body should point this out. We Muslims are not asking anyone to throw vulgarities or any hatred to LKY, we just need them to point out to LKY that we cannot be less strict as in to close an eye to some of the issues that Islam doesn’t permit e.g. handshakes between a man and a woman who he can marry, drinking even a little bit of alcohol, wearing of tudung for all women, praying 5 times a day, friday prayers, impermissible for us to gamble, etc. These are Mandatory laws that we have to follow and the best part is; it doesn’t hurt any other non Muslims…so why complain?
Islam never discourage modernization in fact encourage that as long as we can practice Islam properly, and it never promote hatred for other religions. We are taught to live with non Muslims in peace and harmony. But Islam do stop us from compensating our religion in order for us to join the westernization and other wrong ideas…like building casinos, pubs, prostitutions, etc…I agree these things make money, in fact makes tonnes of fast cash and boost the economy in a way, but it disturbs the balance of the world and create tonnes of problems at the same time, which is why Islam disagree to it…but if the non Muslims wanna do its up to them, we just won’t support it.
Thanks.
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What makes you right when u put a middle finger to our MM Lee? I strongly believe that u all misunderstand what MM Lee is saying and jump into conclusion. Read his book first before you wanna make all those comment.
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I think so too. I’ve asked around some of my Muslim friends what they think about LKY’s talk on getting Singapore Muslims to be less strict in their religious adherence. All don’t have anything good to say about him… I think he really bought it this time. He is angering the whole Muslim community in Singapore now…
Even another friend who is a Catholic told me that next, LKY will turn to the Catholics and ask them to be less strict in their religious adherence too…
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These two following comments need more highlighting and diffusion on the main page.
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@Zw
>> We’ve got to acknowledge the fact that without lky, sg won’t be as developed and recognized on a global platform like what we are today.
Please! Stop boosting the personality cult of LKY. We’re not North Korea. Singapore has progressed to its current status due to a TEAM of old guards of the PAP, 14 of them. They are the founding fathers of modern Singapore. LKY has been building a personality cult around him giving the impression that he and he alone built Singapore to what it is today. This is false.
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To all brothers and Sisters of Singapore-there’s a lot of crap flying around here.UNITE and get these people out before they take away your children’s future.
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1. The Association of Muslim Professionals (AMP) deeply regrets certain comments made by Minister Mentor (MM) Mr Lee Kuan Yew in his book Hard Truths to Keep Singapore Going. These comments are in relation to the practice of Islam by the Malay-Muslim community (MMC) where MM Lee had urged the MMC to be less strict in their practice of Islam in order to facilitate integration, and in relation to the issue of gaps between the MMC and other communities in Singapore, where MM Lee opined that the MMC will never catch up with the other communities. We note that these views of MM Lee are not new. It is not clear why MM Lee has chosen to repeat them at this point.
2. However, because these views come from MM, and are repeated in print, it is important for the community to set its rejoinders. We do not agree with MM’s views. In our view, MM’s comments have hurt the community and are potentially divisive.
3. Fundamentally, there is nothing wrong for any community in Singapore in being distinct, for it to carry out its religious practices, or in asserting its identity. Islam enjoins Muslims to integrate within the broader Singapore community. It is not mutually exclusive for a good Muslim to be a good Singaporean. In fact, a good Muslim is duty bound, in Islam, to be a good Singaporean.
4. Many other religious communities practise their rituals. There is nothing wrong with this. Further, many ethnic communities assert their identities. Again, there is nothing wrong in this. For example, the state-promoted policy of SAP schools (where it could be argued that students do not have the same opportunity to mingle with other communities) manifests the assertion of the Chinese identity. The Speak Mandarin campaign is yet another example of the assertion of Chinese identity. The MMC has accepted these assertions of identities as part and parcel of living in a multi-ethnic and multi-religious community. Just like other Singaporeans, we celebrate diversity of beliefs and practices. It is therefore perplexing to see the Malay/Muslim community as being unfairly singled out for reasons which we cannot fathom.
5. It is unusual for MM to conclude that Muslims have not integrated based on his sporadic observations of eating practices of Muslims. Many Muslims have no qualms sharing tables with their non-Muslim friends and colleagues. Muslims are obliged to observe certain dietary restrictions, inasmuch as people subscribing to other religions (e.g. Buddhists or Hindus who do not consume certain types of foods) or others having dietary restrictions (vegetarians, vegans). It is a stretch and disingenuous to suggest that Muslims are against or less likely to integrate primarily on account of our dietary restrictions or eating habits.
6. Ironically, MM’s comments, which had purported to touch on integration, could be potentially divisive. MM’s comments create the misperception that the MMC is against or disinterested in integration, which is untrue and unfounded. It tends to perpetuate this misperception for younger Singaporeans in particular, who may take his views, as the first Prime Minister of Singapore, as the truth. These misperceptions could hinder integration going forward.
7. Apart from the issue of the practice of Islam, MM had also commented that the Malay/Muslim community will never catch up with other communities in Singapore. Again, this is regrettable. To state this in print is effectively condemning the MMC as a lagging and marginalised community, even in the longer term.
8. MM’s comments also raise questions as to whether they reflect the thinking of other political leaders. Does this thinking (relating to the misperception of Muslims being disinterested in integration, or that the MMC will never catch up with other communities) affect, directly or indirectly, other government policies? If this is not the case, then the State should clarify this. Otherwise, the perception will be that the comments expressed by MM Lee, as a core member of the Cabinet, reflects the official position of the Government.
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This is another reply to MUSLIM PATRIOT,
Friend – a long time ago, I was a member of AMP. I have worked with Malay-Muslim NGO’s. So please don’t anyhow make assumptions. I have been around for quite some time.
Regards
Dr Syed Alwi
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To ADAMONE,
Najib’s 1Malaysia is very close to the spirit of Unity In Diversity. Malaysia’s official religion is Islam – see Article 3 of Malaysia’s Consitution. However Najib knows that Ketuanan Melayu and Ketuanan Islam is no longer feasible in a modern Malaysia – hence 1Malaysia – which is based on the concept of Unity In Diversity.
Ultimately PAS and UMNO must unite for the sake of the Malays of the Nusantara.
The problem with PAS and UMNO is that the Overseas Chinese in ASEAN do NOT want a social climate that is too Islamic and neither do they want a Ketuanan Melayu.
So how should Muslims govern a multi-racial society ? Only one way and that is – UNITY IN DIVERSITY !
Regards
Dr Syed Alwi
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To AMP,
I fully agree with your views in your letter. 100% agree with what you say in that letter.
Regards
Dr Syed Alwi
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this guy here has lost his mind
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@Dr Syed Alwi:
Good to know that some of these NGOs like AMP are not “intimidated” by PAP and are willing to come out and say what is right
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wow, i’m sorry to see the very harsh words used here…
my dear muslim brothers, sisters, friends and family, i do understand your unhappiness, but i hope you will not be overwhelmed by anger. i hope you will understand that his view is not representative of the majority of the non-muslims here in singapore. i, as a chinese non-muslim, do appreciate and understand many islamic teachings, and i know that islam is a very peace-loving religion.
we all know what is best for us. what others say should not affect our values and beliefs. hang on to your own beliefs, as long as they do good to you and others.
try to forgive. remember what the prophet did in taif? he prayed for forgiveness and guidance for those ignorant people in taif, becausse they did not know what they were doing. applicable here, i think…
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This is my FINAL reply to DR SYED ALWI.
If indeed you have been around for a long time, and have worked with MMOs, it is most unfortunate that you have come away with the observation that Malay NGOs are all PAP-controlled. But this is purely your observation, and does not reflect my views, and views of many others I know personally who have been involved with Malay NGOs for decades. That AMP issued a statement of disapproval pertaining to MM Lee’s comments also suggests that Malay NGOs (I consider AMP an NGO) are not all PAP-controlled.
Regards,
Muslim Patriot
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he already objected once when his daughter ran to the usa with a bengali doctor, remember?
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And this is my FINAL REPLY to MUSLIM PATRIOT,
Maybe one or two Muslim NGO’s are not PAP controlled – for example AMP. But by and large – civil society in Singapore is largely PAP controlled. Thats a fact of life in Singapore.
As for me – I have family problems and that is why its difficult for me to participate actively in civil society or community service.
Regards
Dr Syed Alwi
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TR is an instigator.Don’t shoot blindly use your brain.
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Dr.Syed Alwi “U in D” @
To claim unity in diversity for Malaysia/Singapore it has to be Satu Bungsa or One Nationality without emphasis on the prefix malay than and only than does UNITY in DIVERSITY stand as in Indonesia till than 1(one) Malaysia,Malaysian Malaysia are one and the same.
LKY was not wrong neither is Najib.
Dyaks,Kadazan are mostly malay Christians and would, may prefer BUMI rather than malay not that they are ashame of being a malay but rather proud to be addressd as Dyak or Kadazan likewise in Indonesia calling themselves Javanese,Menadonese,Bataks,Minangs and many many more.
Is this now clearer or do I need to bring you back to the time when Mahathir open the doors for the Indonesians to fill up KL after may 13 not realizing that quite a number were malay Christians from Indonesia bringing their Alkitabs(Holy Bible) along so much so they had to BAN the use of Alkitab(Holy Bible) in West Malaysia and forbidding Allah as the name of GOD in Christian teaching right up till today needing to bring the matter to the High Court.
In Lebanon,Syria and Egypt the teachings of the Bible,sermons and Hymms are in Arabic the sole language of the KORAN.
ALLAH is also know as GOD in these areas.Tuhan is never heard of in the Middle East the birth place of ISLAM.
My dear Dr. are you aware of all these???
In the Middle East I greet my friends with “Peace be with you” in Arabic and they response but here when you greet some muslims in Arabic “peace be with you” they totally ignore you and do not acknowledge.Are they better practicing muslims than my Middle eastern friends??? please don’t tickle my toes.
There my dear Dr. lies the problem, some NUSANTARA muslims are trying to outdo the Arabs from the middle east where the Great Religion of Islam was BORN.
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there is a comment by plastique from sgclub.com which i feel that it makes sense to what MM Lee means.
*please delete if my comment is deemed controversial.
In my opinion, MM’s view and Islam both desired integration peacefully definitely. But the question is, that both parties definitely will have different views and definition in “integration” which is:
MM’s definition: An integration of muslims into a socio-political society.
Islam’s definition: An integration of people into Islamic ideology.
I respect Islam as a good and just religion but no one side will backdown on their views with regard to integration for the next few decades or the next century and in Singapore, I believe the status-quo will no see much changes without any one party doing something extreme and radical. Which is 1 of the reason we can’t afford to have a weak government in power.
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and to our friend here scolding and cursing the whole family of MM Lee dun act almighty here start all your rubbish here, 2 words for you. Grow up
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“I will spread the true word of Islam to my non-Muslim friends and that is, “live and let live and respect each other religions”. I will spread the word of racial harmony, intermarriages, etc to my Muslim and non-Muslim brothers and sisters.”
So much for showing respect with all your scolding. *clap*
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can some religious expert explain how to be less strict in practising muslim?
- is it to pray less times in a day? maybe just pray 3 times only after every meal?
- is it can eat a little pork like chinese and indians?
like eat wanton mee, can have 1-2 wanton and some charsiew to enjoy real wanton mee flavour?
is it maybe young boys can skip go hosiptal not to cut the penis skin, because next time the head not so sensitive and cannot enjoy the sex?
i think mmlee idea is not to ask muslims to relax the gambling restrictions, since singaporeans cannot go casino anyway. but he just want muslim brothers not to get upset and become terrorist like pakistanis and saudis just because chinese and indians can do things like unrestricted sex and eat pork and drink alcohol, and women can wear bikinis and show parts of their body, other normal things that some muslims say is sinful to their allah.
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Dear ADAMONE,
In Islam there is something called ‘URF – culture or tradition pertaining to a particular society. In ASEAN – before colonial times – the word Allah was used only by the Malay-Muslims.
Post colonial its different – but I think MABIMS has to look into this. ASEAN must sit down and talk frankly instead of certain leaders making unilateral remarks.
Regards
Dr Syed Alwi
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Lao A
Chi Pia shi liao.
Rou Kong Rou Chia Lak.
Old man
This time die lao.
More worng when more are said.
You think want to help your son by opening your golden mouth. Hello this is 2011 and Aliens may land on earth anytime.
I bet your are reading TR too and that make you very insecured now right? That why all these rubbish keep flowing out from your mouth.
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lest we forgot, mas selamat became involved to bomb singapore because he became “strict” muslim….
it seems a well known fact that when muslim kanna physco, and become very strict in religion, they easily get angry when other people talk about their religion, as though they cannot tahan even anything.
then when they angry, muslim always seem to lose their common sense and become violent and do violent things.
please, i am not trying to insult muslims here, but this is a honest observation since the last 2 decades.
how do muslim react when they get angry over religious matters? they run riot, kill people, create bombs and kill lots of people right? that’s not just saying – it is actually happening. can any muslim brothers here deny that such things never happened?
why muslim brothers behave like that?
do chinese, indians and christians behave so extreme?
that’s why i think mmlee has a point. – muslim need to tone down their act and behave more commonsense like other singaporeans.
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in a society i believe they will always be disagreements.
there’s disagreement between husbands and wives
there’s disagreements between parents and childrens
there’s disagreements between friends
there’s disagreements between colleagues and business partners
if not happy, then go court fight it out, see who got more “reason”.
this is the way all people – chinese, indian, angmo behave.
but it seems some muslims can more easily react to diagreements with extreme violence.
and fellow muslim, instead of reining in their violent brothers – go all the way to habour them – and in doing so, put other singaporeans in real danger.
how to co-exist like that?
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Walahhi
Mr LKY forgetting you not critiquing the local Muslim but the other 2 billion Muslim around the world
as Muhamed S.A.W mention there will in time come went they the non-muslim will find Islam is a Strange religion, where we muslim go back to the teaching of the Quran and Sunnah.
To Muis Please fear Allah not the Govt, remember in the day of judgement you the Leaders will be the first to be question in the courts of Allah(god) and Islam is not the a religion that can be alter to suit your or some one else purpose, go back to our Quran, Hadith and Sunnah, Muis repent before is too late.
To our muslim bro that respond to to LKY comment above, there is right and wrong 1st i give you thumbs up of your reply to LKY comment, the wrong is you wrote it in anger and there a couple of harsh word is written, we should always remember what would our Prophet Muhamed S.A.W would do in this kind of situation Muhamed S.A.W is a gentle, Kind Hearted, well manner person, even went Muhamed S.A.W send a letter to Persian Emperor and he torn the letter up, Muhamed S.A.W did not get angry, we must follow by his example as best as we can islam is easy everything is already been layout
for us to follow.
To all Muslim do not over react on LKY comment allah is testing us weather pass of fail his test only allah knows and to our non-Muslim friends do not fear or hate us muslim even if you find islam is a strange religion, Islam has been contributing a lot to world from the existing Technology we see today, design, Airplane, political, medical, Math etc.. since the beginning of the Islamic empire,best look at spain during early Islamic Rule and Muhamed S.A.W close friends how they lead their people by example. There are books on islamic History in detail in islamic bookstore.
and Of course there is always be a few rotten apples (your typical Jihadist). And to all Muslim in singapore
do not fall to this propaganda you Malay Muslim, Indian muslim etc… this are tactics to divide us always remember We Are Muslims we stand under one flag and that is Islam which is sad to say we easily fall into Colonial Master has set in our mind, Remember our hero Salahudin did went he receive a message that the Templars is planing to invade Mecca he united Us and rise an Large army of Muslim form every where to battle the Crusaders that have broken the truce.
Islam is the solution to mankind Problem.
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[Quote: What an idiotic comment…Didn’t make any sense to me at all, although you did sound like you’re way much smarter than MM Lee himself!]
You are really idiotic Pro Alien Party and idiot.
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This old man is going to die. But why is he also want to destroy our country.
這老人將要死了，爲何還要將我們的國家陪葬？？
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To all those true blue Singaporeans singapore is coming 2 an end enjoy it while u can cause sooner or later we will b overrun by foreigners
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To SingaporeanMuslim.
Yes I do agree with you.. but.. you should understand where are the non muslims (LKY) coming from. Assuming they know nuts about Islam. When they see our ‘corrupted’ malay muslims they will start to think that WE are modernized muslims. We can’t totally blame others cos we show , we proved how ‘modernized’ we are. If we truly follow our Islamic ‘law’..perhaps this kinda issue wouldn’t exist now.
Afterall..different ppl has their different kind of perspective view.
Im not siding any party..just stating the fact. No point arguing if we still choose to live in Singapore isn’t it?
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i sorry if my comments make people angry.
please delete if my comment upset some people.
just hope everyone can live peacefully in one country.
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@soft in the head oops softhearted-Mas Selamat’s actions as well as others of his ilk are an abomination even for Muslims too. You don’t seem to be able to tell what is culture and what is religion.Do your Muslim neighbours here(if u have any) riot every time you burn your joss paper?Do they throw a table at you just for staring them?Probably not! But a Chinese Pia Kia will do it-worse he might just kill you as illustrated in recent events here.
Do not equate what you see on the news in Pakistan,or the Middle East to be what a Muslim truly is.Have you seen a riot in India? Or for that matter how about a riot in China? What about the numerous reports of PRC rioting in our country-the famous KTV case for instance. What about the Oaklahoma bombings and what about all the other bombings perperated by the IRA. Are they Muslims? History has numerous examples of how violent the Chinese can be and there are also similar reports on Indians and even Christians.So Violence is not something limited to the Muslims anyone Bolih!
I repeat I am not condoning the actions of those radicals but pushed to a corner even you will become like them.
So think carefully before you open that whole on your face-lest some turd gets into it
For the rest of my Singaporean brothers and sisters.UNITE! Kick them out
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Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely!!!!
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AMP replied…
http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150091824756169&id=1538294332
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I think we shouldn’t get all too worked up just by a mere remark from an old man, especially the muslims for i am a muslim myself. In such situations before reacting, we muslims should always refer back to our roots and teachings as to how we should react. By throwing harsh remarks, words of hatred to the person or anywhere for that matter, it won’t undo what’s been done.
Yes, it’s true. It angers the muslim community including me. Then again, the old man is also human, never free from errors and sins like each one of us. So we are no better than him to curse and swear at him or his family. To do so, we are just being like him and in fact reflect such a bad image of how muslims react over here. Like the words of our beloved prophet Muhammad(pbuh): “..A strong individual isn’t the one who wields and show power, but someone who remains patient, silent in times of hardship and keep striving and praying for the better without causing death, bloodshed and discrimination..”
Yes, anger is sometimes counterproductive. But we muslims should remember instead that in anger itself, is evil. So be smart. As muslims, we should know what is right and wrong, halal and haram and we should just abide by that. To those who slander against our religion or our community, we wish them well for God has already prepared them punishment, such is stated in our holy book Qur`an.
So have faith. Make Peace when the world itself is reaching it’s boiling point.
And to those, who think there’s no social integration in Islam and Islam is anti-social, I suggest that you should really travel or maybe read more about Islam (find the proper sources please, and not those aimed at creating Islamophobia).
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Hi, i’d like to share my experience as a muslim w.r.t what MM Lee said about Muslims not being able to integrate. Firstly, i seek refuge from none other than Allah from the whispers of syaitan. Peace to all my brothers and sisters be it Hindu, Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, etc.
In NS, i was posted as a specialist, particularly the only malay specialist in my company amongst a batch of predominantly chinese group of specialist. For over a year, i’ve made close bonds with these chinese group of guys whom i regard as my brothers. These non-muslim brothers of mine never had qualms that i had to eat only halal food or that i need to take a minute or two away for awhile to do my prayers. Although, i am not allowed to drink. I still hang out and sit with them at pubs just to catch up but never once did i ever tasted a sip of alcohol. Mutual understanding. Give and take. Allah will be my judge whether or not my actions were right or wrong but i believe the whole nation has been integrating with one another SO WELL until MM Lee had to comment this out of proportion.
I really wish he is reading this comment right now because i seriously lost all hope on him (despite him being the founding founder of our country) when he said that. MM Lee never publicly mingled with the Muslims, lived amongst the Muslims or even socialised with the Muslims, unlike our SM Goh Chok Tong who was a familiar face at Muslim events when he was PM at the time. This is a man who works towards social integration. Who actually believes in the multi-racial structure that is Singapore. Why highlight the issue now when 40 over years of independence, all the collective sacrifices and hard work of the nation is only going to spark a racial/religious divide because of what MM Lee says?
What i can think of is simple, MM Lee is going to lose power due to his old age so rather let the future generation of PAP leaders to work with an already stable nation, you go and say something SO insensitive like that so that no one can enjoy the success that you solely created over the past 40+ years since SG’s independence.
On a final note, i IMPLORE all of you alike, be in Chinese, Indian, Malay, or Eurasian alike to not take what MM Lee said and continue this close bond we have as a nation and set our differences aside and work towards a common goal in this turbulent times ahead. The economy is not doing well as it already is and all we need right now is for us to be divided in tough times ahead. THINK ABOUT IT PLEASE.
What MM Lee said hurts, but it will hurt even more if Singapore becomes a racial divided nation. All the sacrifices our forefathers made going down the canals and drain..
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